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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5786 Posts

Posted - November 21 2021 :  09:39:00 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The Rittenhouse case may be our best example of the old saying 'Don't go anyplace with a gun that you wouldn't go without a gun'.

Jeff

jle3030

Pop Pop
Advanced Member

USA
1526 Posts

Posted - November 21 2021 :  10:22:49 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Don't go to stupid places, and do stupid things with stupid people. I believe John Farnum said this.

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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5786 Posts

Posted - November 21 2021 :  11:07:09 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I can't be certain, of course, but I think I see Rittenhouse's line of reasoning. A young idealistic kid sees the rioting going into its third night, virtually unopposed by government authorities. He wants to do something to help people and property affected by the madness. He knows there is danger of physical attack. He might need to be armed in order to defend himself from the mob. He can't have a handgun, but he can legally possess and carry the AR15. So he does.

And it turns out that he was right. His worst fears were realized. And then some. But he's alive, which he might not be had he not had the AR with him. His big mistake in the first place was trying to do a good thing. His decisions and the subsequent events flowed from there. Youth, naivete, and inexperience are often a dangerous mix.

Jeff

jle3030

Edited by - jle3030 on November 21 2021 11:10:27 AM
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ASCTLC
Senior Member

784 Posts

Posted - November 21 2021 :  11:24:19 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I don't think it can be overlooked that Kyle's pursuit going to WI to help while people were burning it down is not too unlike brave young kids who join the military wanting to do the world and humanity some good against injustice and evil.
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Chris Christian
Advanced Member

USA
3860 Posts

Posted - November 21 2021 :  11:49:25 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ASCTLC

I don't think it can be overlooked that Kyle's pursuit going to WI to help while people were burning it down is not too unlike brave young kids who join the military wanting to do the world and humanity some good against injustice and evil.



I can see... and to an extent... agree with that. I can also... to an extent... agree with jle3030 post.

As far as "Don't go any place with a gun that you wouldn't go without one." In today's world just where is there such a place?

Chris Christian
There are those who make things happen. There are those who watch things happen. There are those who wonder What The Heck happened! Pick one.
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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5786 Posts

Posted - November 21 2021 :  1:11:08 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I'm of two minds on this.

Try to resist the mob and your life can be ruined, as it appears to be for Kyle Rittenhouse.

Allow the mob rule to continue unopposed ... and they don't intend to stop any time soon ... then what can we expect to be the ultimate fate of our nation?

Jeff

jle3030
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gauchobill
Advanced Member

1201 Posts

Posted - November 22 2021 :  07:16:04 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Sadly, the media and their heroes, the Liberals, have the view that protests that involve looting, mayhem, and destruction are o.k. ("mostly non-violent"); and anyone who resists the momentum of that mob or reacts in self-defense is a white supremacist, racist, xenophobe, or homophobe.

In the interest of self-preservation, I will not be going near the site of such violence. If unknowingly I find myself enveloped in such an environment, I will try to extricate myself ASAP before being forced to self-defend.
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Pop Pop
Advanced Member

USA
1526 Posts

Posted - November 22 2021 :  10:00:25 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Unless it is happening in my front yard, I am not going to be there, if possible. IMO, if you are carrying anything, in the open and not a copper (open Carry), one has set themselves up as a target, knowing Mob mentality being what it is today. I think this young boy/man has a hard "row to hoe" for several years to come. I wish him the best.

I agree with the jury verdict, but he gets a F from me on his decision to go there, however at his age I do understand. Where's his dad and mom????

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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5786 Posts

Posted - November 22 2021 :  10:27:10 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Rittenhouse has said he supports BLM. (Assuming we can trust anything reported in the media.) I think that, plus his actions, speaks to his lack of maturity and awareness.

Jeff

jle3030
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ASCTLC
Senior Member

784 Posts

Posted - November 22 2021 :  10:58:40 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I too question his execution (decision to go there) but thank God I'm not shackled with the dumb crap (idealistic but bad decisions although I didn't do anything to harm someone/property) I did in my teens and 20s!!!

eta: I also don't think his decision to go help was quite as strong as "simply stupid, end of story" and not saying anyone here has that strong of opinion on that. I opinion is influenced because the photos of him "cleaning" up graphiti indicates his intention to actually help and not just go play 'wannabecop'. A slightly different view point but a distinction I believe is warranted.

Edited by - ASCTLC on November 22 2021 12:13:21 PM
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Evan
Administrator

34897 Posts

Posted - November 22 2021 :  1:37:15 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Chris-I'm not even comfortable in an LDS Temple without two!

"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."

Harold B. Lee

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Ace
Advanced Member

USA
6053 Posts

Posted - November 22 2021 :  9:17:10 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
'Do you carry a gun at church?'---I'd like to think I shouldn't need a gun at church.

'Are you carrying a gun now?'---No, I'm not carrying a gun now.

I don't lie, but I did learn some useful things from the Clinton presidency. Ace

Give me $1 every time a Liberal lies, I'll give you $5 every time one tells the truth; I'll end up a wealthy man, you'll end up broke.
If pro-gunners are as murderous as anti-gunners claim, why are there so many anti-gunners still running their mouths?
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oldmuleskinner
Advanced Member

1044 Posts

Posted - November 22 2021 :  10:34:05 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I can always answer the question "Are you carrying a gun?" honestly...
"No, I am not carrying "A" gun!"

The way that I count, 2 or 3 guns does not equate with "A" gun.

Each of us is an innkeeper, and we decide if there is room for Jesus.
Neal A. Maxwell
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gauchobill
Advanced Member

1201 Posts

Posted - November 23 2021 :  06:30:40 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
For at least 5-6 years, I have always carried when I go to church. Sadly, that is one of the places I most feel the need to be armed.
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Ace
Advanced Member

USA
6053 Posts

Posted - November 23 2021 :  10:05:04 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
In regards to young Rittenhouse, my take is that it was stupid for Mom and Dad to allow a 17-year-old kid to go into a riot climate, regardless of good intentions--cleaning graffiti, offering first aid, and guarding someone else's property. Giving a kid a loaded rifle to carry along wasn't too bright. Since he was already there, it was stupid to be going out amongst the rioters for whatever reason. BUT just because he ended up in the situation through stupid actions, doesn't mean he had any duty to let the attackers carry out the attacks and just hope to survive with nothing more than cuts and bruises. The self defense was justified, but the need for it could have been avoided with a little common sense.

There's too much stupid on the part of the attackers' actions for me to address here, I think. Ace

Give me $1 every time a Liberal lies, I'll give you $5 every time one tells the truth; I'll end up a wealthy man, you'll end up broke.
If pro-gunners are as murderous as anti-gunners claim, why are there so many anti-gunners still running their mouths?
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Chris Christian
Advanced Member

USA
3860 Posts

Posted - November 23 2021 :  11:08:33 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ace

In regards to young Rittenhouse, my take is that it was stupid for Mom and Dad to allow a 17-year-old kid to go into a riot climate, regardless of good intentions--cleaning graffiti, offering first aid, and guarding someone else's property. Giving a kid a loaded rifle to carry along wasn't too bright. Since he was already there, it was stupid to be going out amongst the rioters for whatever reason. BUT just because he ended up in the situation through stupid actions, doesn't mean he had any duty to let the attackers carry out the attacks and just hope to survive with nothing more than cuts and bruises. The self defense was justified, but the need for it could have been avoided with a little common sense.

There's too much stupid on the part of the attackers' actions for me to address here, I think. Ace



+1. I think that's a pretty realistic take on the matter.

Chris Christian
There are those who make things happen. There are those who watch things happen. There are those who wonder What The Heck happened! Pick one.
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ASCTLC
Senior Member

784 Posts

Posted - November 23 2021 :  11:47:21 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
That seems to be lost on an awful lot of people Ace. Going was stupid to begin with but it doesn't justify the radicals claim his going meant he was obligated to take whatever life altering beating or risk of death the angry mob wanted to do to anyone who didn't share their violent view and pursuits.

Going was stupid but nowhere near criminal to do.
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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5786 Posts

Posted - November 25 2021 :  07:17:19 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yesterday I received a text recommending a new cocktail: The Rittenhouse

One shot - followed by a chaser - followed by two more shots.

I think I'll pass, but there are those who will try it.

Jeff

jle3030
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Ace
Advanced Member

USA
6053 Posts

Posted - November 25 2021 :  11:08:28 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Jeff, that's just tacky. As bad as the bin Laden cocktail--two shots and a splash. Ace

Give me $1 every time a Liberal lies, I'll give you $5 every time one tells the truth; I'll end up a wealthy man, you'll end up broke.
If pro-gunners are as murderous as anti-gunners claim, why are there so many anti-gunners still running their mouths?
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