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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5629 Posts

Posted - February 29 2020 :  10:05:32 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
So after a week of "reduced violence" to show "good faith" we're going to cut a deal with the Taliban allowing us to leave Afghanistan to its fate.

I suspect most of us old Vietnam vets have seen this coming for a long time. It sure took long enough.

We're left with 2400 dead Americans, countless maimed, and the Taliban will end up back in charge, same as when we started. But at least it's not 58,000. Sorry folks, this is as good as it's gonna get.

"A war to end all wars."
"Peace in our time."
"Peace with honor."
"Nation building."
"Arab Spring"

I wonder what neat sounding catchphrase they'll come up with this time.

Jeff

jle3030

revjen45
Advanced Member

2349 Posts

Posted - February 29 2020 :  1:05:00 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
What they call it isn't the most important thing.
Cutting our losses is the best we can achieve. Pouring more blood and treasure into the black hole sucks even worse.
Afghanistan's resident factions be they religious, political, economic, etc. have enjoyed maintaining a constant state of conflict since the early Paleolithic.
They will continue after we leave.

Better to perish in the struggle for freedom than live to see defeat.
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Chris Christian
Advanced Member

USA
3746 Posts

Posted - February 29 2020 :  2:09:42 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by revjen45

What they call it isn't the most important thing.
Cutting our losses is the best we can achieve. Pouring more blood and treasure into the black hole sucks even worse.
Afghanistan's resident factions be they religious, political, economic, etc. have enjoyed maintaining a constant state of conflict since the early Paleolithic.
They will continue after we leave.


+1. Bringing Western World democracy to a populace that wants to live in the 7th century is a losing proposition. Ain't gonna happen.

Sunni vs Shiite... clan allegiance… warloads running things... He who has the best to offer secures the services of the tribes/warlords.

The place is a mess. It always has been. It always will be. They even have an acceptable social practice for adult men to have sexual relations with male pre-pubescent children. Afghanistan contributes nothing to the World, other than opium and serving as a safe haven for violent terrorists if they pay off the proper controlling faction in their area.

I think it would make a nice "glassed over" parking lot. The World, at large, would be better for it.


Chris Christian
There are those who make things happen. There are those who watch things happen. There are those who wonder What The Heck happened! Pick one.

Edited by - Chris Christian on February 29 2020 2:11:03 PM
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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5629 Posts

Posted - February 29 2020 :  2:58:10 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
What more can we expect from people whose ancestors were run out of all the desirable areas in that part of the world?

Jeff

jle3030
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Ace
Advanced Member

USA
5830 Posts

Posted - February 29 2020 :  3:25:04 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
About the only good to come out of it is we killed a whole pot load more of them than they did us, and none of those dead ones will be coming over here to start something. We have more than enough of them here to go around, anyway.

Woulda been good if they could have scheduled a big meeting with all the Taliban and other leaders in one big room, then when they're all sitting around waiting for our guys who are late to the meeting..... (Sounds like something out of a cheap spy novel, huh?) Ace

Give me $1 every time a Liberal lies, I'll give you $5 every time one tells the truth; I'll end up a wealthy man, you'll end up broke.
If pro-gunners are as murderous as anti-gunners claim, why are there so many anti-gunners still running their mouths?
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Chris Christian
Advanced Member

USA
3746 Posts

Posted - February 29 2020 :  5:08:00 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ace

About the only good to come out of it is we killed a whole pot load more of them than they did us, and none of those dead ones will be coming over here to start something. We have more than enough of them here to go around, anyway.

Woulda been good if they could have scheduled a big meeting with all the Taliban and other leaders in one big room, then when they're all sitting around waiting for our guys who are late to the meeting..... (Sounds like something out of a cheap spy novel, huh?) Ace


OMG!! JADMs are like soooo cool

Chris Christian
There are those who make things happen. There are those who watch things happen. There are those who wonder What The Heck happened! Pick one.
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J Wagner
Junior Member

221 Posts

Posted - March 04 2020 :  11:30:57 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Afghanistan is going to be the same six months after we leave, whether we leave this year, 2025 or 2030.

In my opinion, we should have left around 2003, whenever we realized Bin Laden wasn't there, reserving the right of overflight and to bomb anyone we deemed a threat.
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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5629 Posts

Posted - March 04 2020 :  3:06:36 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
On Monday I worked with a dental assistant who is a bit hard core. During the Obama administration she was an Army MP with a machine gunner MOS. She has zero respect for Obama and the rules of engagement they had to contend with in Afghanistan. Set up at an outpost shared with Afghan Army troops, they took incoming fire virtually every day. Obama ROA's specified that they could not fire at the Taliban until fired upon. You had to watch them set up and wait until they shot at you. Then you were forbidden to return fire if (A) women or children were present, or (B) if the fire was coming from the nearby mosque. So most days she hunkered down behind her gun, unable to shoot back because the bad guys were either shooting from the mosque or had made sure to put some kids out in front.

Relations with the government troops were tenuous. They were poor fighters - if they fought at all. Then some were known to occasionally sneak out at night to plant IED's for our people to find, one way or another, the next day.

Afghans were supposedly offended if they could not see your eyes. So in her unit, being mixed with indigenous troops, they were forbidden to wear sunglasses. She describes the stress of being the gunner on the lead vehicle out on patrol, driving into a blinding rising or setting sun, and it being very difficult to spot an ambush or potential IED.

She is deeply resentful that she lost good friends because the Powers That Be were so sensitive about offending or harming any innocent Afghanis. She and her (now ex) husband were deployed in the same unit, which they decided was not a good idea. They managed to get him transferred out. Within a few weeks his replacement was killed doing the exact job her husband would have been doing. Their divorce was due to mutual survivor's guilt, mutual PTSD, and his drinking.

We should have been out of that place years ago.

Jeff

jle3030
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Chris Christian
Advanced Member

USA
3746 Posts

Posted - March 04 2020 :  4:38:18 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
There's a logical reason why Obama's middle name is Hussain". That hard core dental assistant is right. His sympathies did not lie with the troops... at least not US troops.

Chris Christian
There are those who make things happen. There are those who watch things happen. There are those who wonder What The Heck happened! Pick one.
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