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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5517 Posts

Posted - August 22 2019 :  08:25:25 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
If you can't solve the escalating crime problem, at lest make it sound less bad.

The San Francisco Board of Supervisors, with the agreement of the District Attorney, have adopted new jargon to "Help change people's views about those who commit crimes". Referring to someone as a felon, they claim, brands a person with a "scarlet letter" and can impede their return to a useful life in law abiding society. So such pejorative words as 'criminal', 'addict', 'offender', 'convicted felon', etc. are to be removed from the SF criminal justice vocabulary.

The newly accepted terms include 'formerly incarcerated person'; 'involved with the criminal justice system'; and my favorite - 'returning resident'. I've previously seen that burglars and home invaders are now 'unwanted/uninvited visitors'.

So the SF Chronicle offers this new term for a crime victim: "A person who has come in contact with a returning resident who was involved with the justice system and is currently under supervision with a history of substance abuse". See, that mugging wasn't so bad after all was it?

Jeff


jle3030

gw
Advanced Member

4744 Posts

Posted - August 22 2019 :  08:37:12 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I saw something, SF defines criminal activity by degrees

burglary below $750 for example is a ticketable offense, no arrest

I suppose the affect will be a lower crime rate, makes folks look good at election time.......

not hard for me to understand where this is going, saw it in Amsterdam 30 years ago

legal drugs no cops

petty crime, assault, high unemployment. every low life in Europe headed there.

America in the 21st century.....

"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not..."

Edited by - gw on August 22 2019 09:17:40 AM
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fiasconva
Average Member

USA
266 Posts

Posted - August 23 2019 :  3:18:03 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Who thinks these things up???

"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson
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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5517 Posts

Posted - August 23 2019 :  8:02:50 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by fiasconva

Who thinks these things up???

Well, they say liberalism is a form of mental disease...

Addendum: "juvenile offender" is now "Young person impacted by the criminal justice system".

Funny how they find ways to sugar coat criminality while vilifying conservatives with all manner of slanderous invective. Perhaps it's time to be as evil as they seem to believe we are. The progs are playing for keeps. We need to keep up. The hapless middle grounders will end up going with whichever side prevails.

Jeff

jle3030
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ASCTLC
Senior Member

751 Posts

Posted - August 23 2019 :  9:48:22 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
And the epitome of stupidity is they think we're somehownot going to figure out a "young person impacted by the criminal justice system" isn't a juvenile offender or a "returning resident" isn't a convicted felon. Renaming something doesn't change what it is nor justify what was done to earn those designations.
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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5517 Posts

Posted - August 24 2019 :  08:06:34 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I wonder if this is rooted in the arrogant Marxist assumption that the general public, Proletariat (us), is so stupid that it must be controlled by the Intelligentsia (them).

If you are of that mindset and believe you are in control of everything, you still want to look good. So you alter the language and educate the kids accordingly.

Next, I expect feces on the sidewalk to be relabeled as "natural concrete preservative".

Jeff

jle3030

Edited by - jle3030 on August 24 2019 08:18:35 AM
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WR Moore
Senior Member

USA
993 Posts

Posted - August 24 2019 :  11:21:10 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
There may be some deeply buried or subconscioius assumption (of privilege-but they'll never use THAT label) underlying the program. OTOH, there's probably a significant number of folks who actually buy the theory that the label causes "issues". I believe there was a song about this type of thing titled "Queen of Denial". One of things that is truly strange is that "they" figure that the masses will actually listen to them. Obviously never studied the French Revolution.

The sidewalk debris is misplaced organic fertilizer. True story: I once had an over supply of equine waste products. When I put an ad on an electronic bill board offering free manure, I got no takers. After I rebranded it as organic fertilizer, it was gone in about 10 days.


Beware the politically obsessed. They are often bright and interesting, but they have something missing in their natures, there is a hole, an empty place and they use politics to fill it up. It leaves them somehow misshapen. Peggy Noonan


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Chris Christian
Advanced Member

USA
3617 Posts

Posted - August 24 2019 :  3:33:56 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
So... given SF's new "wordspeak"... I guess that means that child molesters are now--- Pre-adolescent Sexual Guidance Councilors/Facilitators?

Sorry... I could not stop there... how about the slime that run into a store with a gun and hold the place up? I guess that are now "Wealth Redistribution Advocates?"

Seems like a logical conclusion. If you don't want the deed to be described in traditionally accurate terms... just give it a new name!




Chris Christian
There are those who make things happen. There are those who watch things happen. There are those who wonder What The Heck happened! Pick one.

Edited by - Chris Christian on August 24 2019 3:47:16 PM
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gw
Advanced Member

4744 Posts

Posted - August 24 2019 :  4:46:31 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
reports are 1 out of 5 people you meet in SF have a record

that might have something to do with the new policy......

"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not..."
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Chris Christian
Advanced Member

USA
3617 Posts

Posted - August 24 2019 :  5:20:59 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by gw

reports are 1 out of 5 people you meet in SF have a record

that might have something to do with the new policy......



Where.. and from what reputable source... did that figure come from? That seems a bit excessive for a city of that size and population... even with liberal leadership. I'd like to know the source of that study/figure, and hopefully it is a realistic study and not just something made up

Chris Christian
There are those who make things happen. There are those who watch things happen. There are those who wonder What The Heck happened! Pick one.

Edited by - Chris Christian on August 24 2019 5:21:52 PM
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gw
Advanced Member

4744 Posts

Posted - August 25 2019 :  12:44:51 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
San Fransisco Board of Supervisors at meeting calling for change in language

"The board noted that about 1 in every 5 Californians has a criminal record and the language that often accompanies those records can dehumanize and devalue the individual."

US Bureau of Justice

"68million people in this country are living with a criminal record. That’s one in every four adults – 20 million people with felony convictions, 14 million new arrests every year, 2.2 million people residing in jail or prison."

"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not..."
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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5517 Posts

Posted - August 25 2019 :  08:58:14 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Great information, GW.

Sobering, but it certainly should reinforce a person's decision to go armed in this world.

Do you know if there is a state by state breakdown of those Bureau of Justice totals? I would assume that's how they compile their numbers.

Jeff

jle3030
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gw
Advanced Member

4744 Posts

Posted - August 25 2019 :  10:34:38 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by jle3030

Great information, GW.

Sobering, but it certainly should reinforce a person's decision to go armed in this world.

Do you know if there is a state by state breakdown of those Bureau of Justice totals? I would assume that's how they compile their numbers.

Jeff



there is a 2012 USBJS report

Survey of State Criminal History Information Systems, 2012

if you can decipher the data, California looks to be about the average

it's all a bit dated, FBI statitics most current has about 30% or 1 in 3 with a criminal record.

young black males with records vs young white males is about equal

but the black population,at about 12.5% of the total population, account for about 25% of all negative contact with law enforcement.

take from that what you will

seems to show the SF Board of Supervisors may be concervative in their statement

also speaks to a need for criminal justice reform, we are rapidly moving to a day when 50% of the population will be basically unemployable, not good for the economy in the long run.

drug screening is achieving a simular result, applicants can'te pass a drug test

can't get a job or serve in the military

seems like the only job an American can get with a history of drug use is President of the United States

what a mess......


"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not..."
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WR Moore
Senior Member

USA
993 Posts

Posted - August 25 2019 :  11:16:02 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
About that "criminal record" thingee. Some states treat minor traffic offenses as "criminal" or "arrests". While it may be technically correct, it's not what most folks think of when they hear the term. When I applied for the job I eventually retired from, I had to dredge up my traffic sins from decades previous. Dunno if they were checking honesty or if they deemed those possible precursors to future behavior.

I've been amazed at the number of folks I've observed who, despite being subject to random drug testing, still "experimented" with forbidden substances.

Beware the politically obsessed. They are often bright and interesting, but they have something missing in their natures, there is a hole, an empty place and they use politics to fill it up. It leaves them somehow misshapen. Peggy Noonan


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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5517 Posts

Posted - August 25 2019 :  11:20:00 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Great data. Thanks!

Jeff

jle3030
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Chris Christian
Advanced Member

USA
3617 Posts

Posted - August 25 2019 :  12:26:02 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by WR Moore

About that "criminal record" thingee. Some states treat minor traffic offenses as "criminal" or "arrests". While it may be technically correct, it's not what most folks think of when they hear the term. When I applied for the job I eventually retired from, I had to dredge up my traffic sins from decades previous. Dunno if they were checking honesty or if they deemed those possible precursors to future behavior.

I've been amazed at the number of folks I've observed who, despite being subject to random drug testing, still "experimented" with forbidden substances.


Good point on the "criminal record thingy". I too have a traffic ticket in my distant past. Does that mean I'm one of the the 1 in 3 Americans with a "criminal record"? It didn't prevent me from getting a FL CCW permit... or purchasing guns from an FFL dealer.

One has to wonder how this "criminal record thingy" statistic is being used.

I am quite confident that 1 in 3... or 1 in 5... of the people I deal with daily do not have a felony or misdemeanor conviction... traffic ticket?, probably. Does that mean they have a criminal record? Does that mean they are "returning citizens"?

Chris Christian
There are those who make things happen. There are those who watch things happen. There are those who wonder What The Heck happened! Pick one.
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gw
Advanced Member

4744 Posts

Posted - August 25 2019 :  1:54:38 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
it's arrest, indictment, or conviction data for the most part in this survey

the NICS data is filtered differently, but if you've ever been delayed, there might be some of this data involved, at least so says the FBI

there is no standard reporting system state to state apparently

economists estimate $billions of lost productivity based on false returns during criminal background checks

at any rate, I was questioned on where I got my information, this is it....

"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not..."
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Chris Christian
Advanced Member

USA
3617 Posts

Posted - August 25 2019 :  3:42:17 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by gw

it's arrest, indictment, or conviction data for the most part in this survey

the NICS data is filtered differently, but if you've ever been delayed, there might be some of this data involved, at least so says the FBI

there is no standard reporting system state to state apparently

economists estimate $billions of lost productivity based on false returns during criminal background checks

at any rate, I was questioned on where I got my information, this is it....



GW...Thanks for the follow up. It's nice to know that I'm not a "returning citizen", and that the data you first reported... as spectacular and thought provoking as it was... was flawed.

We can all be the victims of reporting bad data if we bite too soon on incorrect numbers, take the stats bait, and don't spend a moment or two to actually verify its authenticity, and factual basis.

But it is comforting to know that the folks on this forum can admit their mistakes.

Chris Christian
There are those who make things happen. There are those who watch things happen. There are those who wonder What The Heck happened! Pick one.

Edited by - Chris Christian on August 25 2019 3:53:05 PM
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gw
Advanced Member

4744 Posts

Posted - August 25 2019 :  4:26:03 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
that information is correct as far as the USBJS survey is concerned, this is the type of data Government uses

and it seems to be ripe for abuse

things like "red flag laws" and "enhanced background checks" come to mind

like the terrorist watch list, you get put into a box you can't find your way out of

The SF Board might have had good intentions after all.......

"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not..."
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