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 Fiochi, Double Tap and Armcor
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Jim Higginbotham
Moderator

USA
9685 Posts

Posted - August 30 2018 :  1:10:39 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Did a little chrono work this morning in the cloud cover; .38 Spl, .44 Magnum and .45 Colt.

First a bit of a disappointment.

Fiochi (new) 158 gr JHP (this is the new pointy bullet not the old JHP with lead exposed) went 701 in a 4" K-38 and 665 in a 2" Model 15. We tested it in water some time back - it did not expand.

The old Fiochi load was much better.

Double Tap standard pressure 148 Wad-cutter: 776 in the 4" and 746 in the 2". Advertised on the website at 800 and 750 that is pretty darn close.

Armscor .44 Magnum "cowboy load" - this is a hard cast 240 gr SWC - nice looking bullet! 1085 fps from a 5" 629 - "this dog will hunt!"

Armscor .45 Colt "cowboy load" - a 255 gr hard cast SWC with a wide meplat - 855 fps.

All of the above had SDs of less than 20 fps - very consistent.

Jim H.

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Ace
Advanced Member

USA
5351 Posts

Posted - August 30 2018 :  4:17:14 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
What was the barrel length on the .45?

Shot a 100# pig with that load, he was duly impressed. Not much of a test, though; he was only 12 feet away, and shot him through the ears. Ace

Give me $1 every time a Liberal lies, I'll give you $5 every time one tells the truth; I'll end up a wealthy man, you'll end up broke.
If pro-gunners are as murderous as anti-gunners claim, why are there so many anti-gunners still running their mouths?
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Jim Higginbotham
Moderator

USA
9685 Posts

Posted - September 01 2018 :  08:30:51 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ace

What was the barrel length on the .45?

Shot a 100# pig with that load, he was duly impressed. Not much of a test, though; he was only 12 feet away, and shot him through the ears. Ace



Sorry about that, 4 5/8" Ruger

Jim

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Ace
Advanced Member

USA
5351 Posts

Posted - September 01 2018 :  09:54:25 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks Jim. I was wondering what it would do from a 6" M25. My 4 5/8" Ruger loves the load; had to file down the rear sight on the S&W to get it to shoot POA, but for group size it likes it too. Ace

Give me $1 every time a Liberal lies, I'll give you $5 every time one tells the truth; I'll end up a wealthy man, you'll end up broke.
If pro-gunners are as murderous as anti-gunners claim, why are there so many anti-gunners still running their mouths?
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Jim Higginbotham
Moderator

USA
9685 Posts

Posted - September 02 2018 :  09:37:33 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ace

Thanks Jim. I was wondering what it would do from a 6" M25. My 4 5/8" Ruger loves the load; had to file down the rear sight on the S&W to get it to shoot POA, but for group size it likes it too. Ace



I looked online for a deal but even SG Ammo has them for only a few cents less than Rural king (if you count shipping - which is more than reasonable from SG).

I'm definitely buying some more before they find out I like them!

I have a 5" S&W and somewhere buried in a safe somewhere a 6" Anaconda. Plus 5.5" and 7.5" SAAs - I'll probably try them at some point but 855 was sure good enough for me. I imagine it will do 900-925 from a 6" but all wheel guns are individuals.

Jim

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Ace
Advanced Member

USA
5351 Posts

Posted - September 02 2018 :  2:29:47 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Considering your experience with hunting deer- and pig-size critters with handguns, would you consider that big heavy wide-front Armscor bullet at 850-ish fps suitable at, say, 25 yards or so? I know close shots through a pig's ears, caliber, speed, and weight aren't big issues; but I wouldn't want to be 'under-gunned' for a shot through the ribs on Bambi. I don't do, or recommend, head shots on deer in hunting situations.
Thanks for your input. Ace

Give me $1 every time a Liberal lies, I'll give you $5 every time one tells the truth; I'll end up a wealthy man, you'll end up broke.
If pro-gunners are as murderous as anti-gunners claim, why are there so many anti-gunners still running their mouths?

Edited by - Ace on September 02 2018 2:30:50 PM
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Chris Christian
Advanced Member

USA
3312 Posts

Posted - September 02 2018 :  2:43:07 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ace

Considering your experience with hunting deer- and pig-size critters with handguns, would you consider that big heavy wide-front Armscor bullet at 850-ish fps suitable at, say, 25 yards or so? I know close shots through a pig's ears, caliber, speed, and weight aren't big issues; but I wouldn't want to be 'under-gunned' for a shot through the ribs on Bambi. I don't do, or recommend, head shots on deer in hunting situations.
Thanks for your input. Ace



Ace, I'm not Jim. But I've shot a fair number of pigs and deer with a handgun. IMHO a 45 cal wide metplat bullet at 850 fps will break shoulders. But the 'classic heart/lung' shot is likely to leave you with miles of tracking. Kick that bullet up to 1400+ fps (Casull velocities) and you'll get better results... although the CIQ (critter in question) is still going to run. You just get a more easily-followed blood trail with the higher velocity... it tends to make a much larger hole on the offside ... which is (along with the mouth) where blood flows from on that body hit.

Just my thoughts. Free, as always. So worth every penny you paid for them.

BTW... I do not mind a pig/deer running from a heart/lung shot if I have dry ground to track on. The animal bleeds out, which makes the meat easier to process. Head or spine shots that drop them in their tracks seem to create 'less desirable' meat.

Chris Christian
There are those who make things happen. There are those who watch things happen. There are those who wonder What The Heck happened! Pick one.
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gauchobill
Advanced Member

1080 Posts

Posted - September 03 2018 :  6:30:55 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Never lost a deer shot thru rib cage. None ran more than 100 yds., most ran 50-75 yds. +1 to Chris' comment on better bleed out when shot thru heart/lung area.
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Jim Higginbotham
Moderator

USA
9685 Posts

Posted - September 04 2018 :  12:52:36 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I completely agree with Chris' assessment on results of certain hits.

For me I decided long ago I want to drop them as quick as possible, especially boar since they can do (and I've seen them ) damage in just a couple of seconds (they don't always and in fact probably don't more often than not, but I've seen both dogs and guides that have been hurt by them after being shot).

Mind you I do not look down on anyone who chooses exsanguination as the mechanism for bagging game, it just isn't quite the results I desire (but have lived with at times).

Jim

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Chris Christian
Advanced Member

USA
3312 Posts

Posted - September 04 2018 :  1:12:10 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jim Higginbotham

I completely agree with Chris' assessment on results of certain hits.

For me I decided long ago I want to drop them as quick as possible, especially boar since they can do (and I've seen them ) damage in just a couple of seconds (they don't always and in fact probably don't more often than not, but I've seen both dogs and guides that have been hurt by them after being shot).

Mind you I do not look down on anyone who chooses exsanguination as the mechanism for bagging game, it just isn't quite the results I desire (but have lived with at times).

Jim



Jim, totally agree on the big boar hogs. In the unlikely event I ever shoot one of those (I have no need for THAT meat)... I'd be busting head/neck/spine... get 'em on the ground fast! They can be as bad as a bear.
But, since much of my hunting has been a 'shopping trip' (I very carefully pick which hogs I shoot, although deer are a different matter) I do tend to like a good, or a couple, heart/lung shots.I'm also a very patient fellow and have good tracking skills.

My regret is that doesn't always allow me to follow that 'good old boy Southern adage'... "Where's the best place to shoot a deer?"

10 feet from a pick up truck

Chris Christian
There are those who make things happen. There are those who watch things happen. There are those who wonder What The Heck happened! Pick one.
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Jim Higginbotham
Moderator

USA
9685 Posts

Posted - September 05 2018 :  08:16:15 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote


I loaned a neighbor a .338 Win. Mag and some hand-loads to hunt his first elk.

He brought me some meat and I asked how it worked. He said "great, he rolled downhill right up to the truck!"

Jim

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Chris Christian
Advanced Member

USA
3312 Posts

Posted - September 05 2018 :  2:40:32 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I once shot an incoming wood duck that fell right in my boat, and I only had to duck a little

Then I had the incoming dove that fell right at my feet, and my English Springer Spanial retriever, at my side, looked up at me as if to say "What's this! Don't I get to play too! Shoot the dang crossers, you jerk!"

But... if I ever go elk hunting, I want one of those .338 mags, and your handloads. They sound really cool

Chris Christian
There are those who make things happen. There are those who watch things happen. There are those who wonder What The Heck happened! Pick one.
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Jim Higginbotham
Moderator

USA
9685 Posts

Posted - September 06 2018 :  08:13:03 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
"Duck" - you are forgiven, glad I wasn't drinking coffee at the time I read that.

I'm pretty sure it was just luck, the load is a 210 Nosler at around 3000 fps - and the elk was a small 3 pointer. He was tasty though!

I still imagine it required a good bit of help just to lift the thing into the truck - it dressed like 600 lbs. It filled the back of the pickup - but it was a short bed.

Jim

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