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 Bad weather & Guns?
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Dov
Advanced Member

USA
2613 Posts

Posted - March 01 2017 :  10:35:10 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Was Wasn't sure what section to post this.

Something I've thought about a bit in last few years is various differences bad weather can impose on gun handling.

Both frequent issues like cold or rain gear impacting speed and possibly safety of weapon handling, as well as more military or extended LEO containment or manhunts.

We've talked a bit about gloves and handguns.

But I've also wondered about things like ponchos/capes allegedly working better according to some with rifle than jackets/parkas.

I've also seen some comments on another forum by gentlemen married to Alaskan native, an Inuit women, about cold weather advantages of Mosin Nagant though part of that is his bias for the Mosin.

But some of his comments about the short LOP and lot of wood covered metal made sense to me, if only because it could justify Mannilicher style Carbine I like

Looking for thoughts and observations.

Only one I feel worth sharing of my own experience is CCW related, I generally avoid wearing my winter gloves in what I consider high threat zones, like parking lots and C stores.

Few years ago I found some reusable non burning hand warmers that also help in everyday winter driving.

You just boil them to recharge, they are called HotSnapZ and Amazon carries them.

The green rectangular ones are good, the smaller orange circular ones just don't last long.

They won't keep your hand warm outside a pocket for any length of time, but inside a pocket do a lot of good.

To activate them just snap little meter piece inside which triggers exothermic (heat producing) action as the liquid turns to solid.

I don't like driving my manual transmission with my winter gloves on, can do it just feels wrong, so I'll often use one of the hand warmers till car heats up enough to keep right hand warm, just holding it when not shifting.

If I was LEO I might just wear nitril gloves as liner glove, I've used nitril gloves as liner when I've had to work on car in unheated garage at -20 F outside temps.

Helps a bit as vapor barrier and keeps skin from sticking to metal.

Edited by - Dov on March 02 2017 07:02:10 AM

Ace
Advanced Member

USA
4862 Posts

Posted - March 01 2017 :  11:47:00 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
BITD, in cold and/or wet weather, my hand(s) in the coat or parka pocket would normally be wrapped around the grip of a Speed Six with bobbed hammer. Didn't have to worry much about drawing from the belt holster. Also, cheap knitted gloves from WalMart worked well to keep the worst of the cold off the fingers, and were thin enough to work the gun, flashlight, and pen; plus they made good liners for the heavier leather Army gloves in really cold, wet, windy weather---like for directing traffic or other chores that 'probably' wouldn't involve needing a gun quickly. The leather gloves would slide off pretty easily with a quick flip of the wrist if more dexterity was needed.
Nowadays, there are other, better, warmer options out there. Ace

Give me $1 every time a Liberal lies, I'll give you $5 every time one tells the truth; I'll end up a wealthy man, you'll end up broke.
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bandaidman
Advanced Member

USA
1266 Posts

Posted - March 02 2017 :  05:58:17 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Having helped with around 20 winter biathalons with conditions ranging from-25 to+40 sunny days to snowstorms I found years ago some metallic gloves that I use as liners for my gore-tex Leather gloves. While I still can get cold hands it's usually when I take my gloves off to work on something like a gun. I have used surgical gloves when I was working on a lacereration and didn't get cold.but they make my hands sweat then I can have cold hands unless I put them in my leather gloves after I'm finished ( if they aren't bloody). The silver gloves I got at an outdoor store years ago, but I've seen their replacement on TV along with-20 socks. Not that I would expect them to work alone at that temperature.
Surgical gloves give you good gripping even when wet, If I had to hold a pistol I would use them, both of my go to rifles are stocked with fiberglass, and are pretty weatherproof. The rubber gloves with big mittons that had a strap around your neck would allow you to keep your hands warm until you needed to use your dexterity, then you shake off the mittons and do what you have to do, not quick but keeps frostbite at bay.

“If for a while the harder you try, the harder it gets, take heart. So it has been with the best people who ever lived.
Jeffery Holland
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gw
Advanced Member

3742 Posts

Posted - March 02 2017 :  07:43:47 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
i hate wearing ponchos, always in the way. my experiance with them was working around large artillery. loose fitting clothes and ponches catching on moving equipment get you screwed up. I wrapped up in my poncho to sleep, got rid of it when it was time to work.

gloves are about as bad, try to get along without them. i trained in Alaska, get so cold your hands would stick to bare metal. We wore just our glove liners handling equipment, get so damn cold weapons didn't work anyway.

you either wear gloves in those environments or your fingers freeze up and don't work anyway. the only good news is the enemy is cold too.

sometimes fighting the weather is all you get done.

"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not..."
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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
4857 Posts

Posted - March 02 2017 :  09:46:37 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Ponchos. I'm trying to envision myself doing a Clint Eastwood sweep to clear the poncho from my Colt revolver...

Until I get that move down, I'll stick with Isotoner or other thin gloves (or no gloves) and the J-frame de facto primary in the coat pocket.

In really cold weather and heavier gloves I also change the holster gun to a DA/SA Sig or an N-frame. For me the Glock or 1911 trigger guards are too small to safely accommodate both a thick gloved trigger finger and a short, light trigger.

Jeff

jle3030
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Evan
Administrator

33982 Posts

Posted - March 02 2017 :  11:45:30 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
A J frame or two in the outside coat pocket. Gloves? Had them but purposely never wore them routinely regardless of how cold it got and the Motor City had some bitter winters!

Participated in a number of searches for serious bad guys in bad weather and a pump 12 gauge was my primary weapon under such circumstances. The Russians had no problems with lube at Stalingrad while the Germans were plagued with sluggish weapons. The Russians secret? They cut gun lube 50/50 with gasoline.

"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."

Harold B. Lee

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Jim Higginbotham
Moderator

USA
9255 Posts

Posted - March 03 2017 :  08:43:02 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I long for the day when military surplus stores sold, ah... actual military surplus.

The U.S. Calvary store (which started in my stomping grounds) used to carry the surplus (but new) German tanker gloves. They are grey and made of pigskin. One type is insulated (and quite warm) but they are a little thick for shooting - the other is just one ply of thin pigskin and works quite well for shooting and works for me to keep the frostbite off but I'd want a bit more if the temperature dipped South of 0 degrees.

They were $5 a pair!

Nomex (the real stuff not the fake) flight gloves are also OK for shooting - at least they work for me.

Lube - one word TW25b - applied correctly. There may be others.

I forget how low a temp TW25b is good for but I think it would be long after I'd frozen to death.

Speaking of cold - "Global Warming" has struck! Here in Kentucky we had an unusually heavy frost - it is white and about an inch thick

Jim H.

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gw
Advanced Member

3742 Posts

Posted - March 03 2017 :  09:10:44 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
after a few weeks in a forward area if you still have ammo and food you're doing good, let alone high tech lube. Resupply ain't always what it needs to be.

you adapt to your environment and learn to make do, it's a slow grind down of your capabilities and equipment fails including cold weather gear.

story is at the Chosin Reservoir, Dec 1950. troops would pee on their weapons in the morning to thaw them out, the warm liquid was the high tech lube provided. Old Marine said the only weapon that kept working was the Garand, the belt feds had WWII era cloth belts and the ammo froze, the carbine was useless. troops slept with their 1911 in the bag with them to keep it functional if they were over run at night.

the good news was that after a time there were plenty of extra Garands laying around, troops picked up ammo and rifles as they moved along.



"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not..."
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WR Moore
Senior Member

USA
798 Posts

Posted - March 03 2017 :  8:09:54 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Back when I hunted deer with a model 29, I used capeskin gloves. Very thin leather, used them as glove liners when things got really cold. Silk gloves also work well as liners to improve insulation. Some years back bought some nice deerskin dress gloves that have good touch.

I really miss the days when mil-surplus actually was both surplus and cheap/reasonable. Closest I've seen in decades is a store in downtown Fredericksburg, VA. Some stuff is Korean made duplicates, but the prices aren't bad and quality good.

The one good thing about the poncho is that you can get your weapon out of the weather. The right lube/amount of lube in cold weather can make a big difference.

Edited by - WR Moore on March 03 2017 8:12:44 PM
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LfiGrad
New Member

USA
55 Posts

Posted - March 05 2017 :  10:44:01 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
WOW. Thank you everyone for reminding me why I moved to Southwest Florida.



If my only choice was a loaded .25 or an unloaded .45, I would choose the empty .45. They both have the same stopping power, but the empty 1911 looks a lot more convincing and makes a better club.
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LittleBill
Advanced Member

3880 Posts

Posted - March 05 2017 :  11:04:48 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
As long as the angry 'minorities' don't rise up and start heading west....


"Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at its testing point"--- C.S. Lewis

"There are some ideas so foolish that only an intellectual could believe them"--- George Orwell

Slow Is Smooth, Smooth Is Fast
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Dov
Advanced Member

USA
2613 Posts

Posted - March 11 2017 :  9:49:05 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
For tapping muzzle of rifle to prevent snow causing unnoticed barrel obstruction, is there any real Pro/cons to type of tape used?

I've heard electrical tape mentioned frequently.

I've also seen Biathlon rifles with built in flip cover that also cover front sight so you don't forget it's up, though it's made to be safe if accidentally fired with it in blocking position.
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ber950
Average Member

USA
362 Posts

Posted - March 13 2017 :  2:54:16 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The only to things I have heard of to cover a muzzle are condoms or ballons and electrical tape. I have used electrical tape, the trick is one layer over the muzzle and then tape the ends down with a spiral. Supposedly the single layer of tape will break before the bullet arrives at the muzzle. I work in the packaging field and there are tapes that are thinner than electrical tape but its available everywhere, pretty strong, the right width and comes off without much of a mess. Painters masking tape wouldn't leave any residue but its more likely to break and defeat the purpose. Alcohol will take off any adhesive residue from the tape.

God, Guns, and Guts made America free. Let's keep all three.
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ASCTLC
Senior Member

612 Posts

Posted - March 13 2017 :  4:27:40 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I've used one of the fingers of a surgical glove over my muzzle before. Was out elk hunting and a good rain started so I took one of the nitrile gloves from my gutting kit and simply bit off one of the fingers and pulled it over the muzzle. Now, I just have a single spare glove and cover the muzzle at the start of the season and leave it on there.

Guess I oughta clarify that I use the spare glove as a source for fingers, not pull the whole glove over the muzzle.

Edited by - ASCTLC on March 13 2017 7:39:54 PM
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retfed89
Advanced Member

USA
1625 Posts

Posted - March 13 2017 :  9:44:16 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I got a couple of the plastic muzzle covers that fit on the flash hider of an AR, stored the AR with one just to keep dust, etc. out of the bbl. while in the safe. Worked fine until one time I went to the range. Yes the AR works if you fire it with the dust cover on, but the accuracy is not good for that first round. The firearms guy that was running me through the range that day has never let me forget it. :-)Retfed
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