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FORT CHAFFEE
Advanced Member

USA
1375 Posts

Posted - February 03 2016 :  6:01:22 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I'm retired now and i have more time to shoot. The problem is i don't know who makes the best 1911 for the money. I don't think this will be a carry gun as i have too many years in with my Glock 19. I just love to shoot a 1911. What does the forum think? Thanks.

gw
Advanced Member

3983 Posts

Posted - February 03 2016 :  6:21:57 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
You don't mention your price range, but if I was buying new I'd be looking at either a Colt Competition Pistol or a Springfield Range Officer. Around here the Colts are selling a bit cheaper and that would make the difference.

I'd also be looking for one in 9mm, if it's a range gun why shoot a .45, the 9mm would be cheaper and recoils like a .22 in a steel frame 1911.

Don't have a minutes worth of time with a Ruger 1911, so I'll keep my opinion to myself on that one.

"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not..."
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Arvinator
Advanced Member

USA
5252 Posts

Posted - February 03 2016 :  9:00:21 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I traded off my ruger 1911...

Be honest, fair, and always prepared...
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Ace
Advanced Member

USA
5045 Posts

Posted - February 03 2016 :  9:14:15 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Just an idea, maybe take a look at the .22TCM by Rock Island. Shoots the TCM round, which (so far) is pretty available, not too expensive, and if you hunt, makes a dandy coyote load; then it comes with a barrel and spring to change over to 9mm, using the same magazine--depending on which model, holds either 8 or 17 rounds; and I've been told there is a .22 conversion kit for it, though I haven't seen one yet.
The gun itself can be had for $650-ish, and I've heard good things about their reliability. Ace

Give me $1 every time a Liberal lies, I'll give you $5 every time one tells the truth; I'll end up a wealthy man, you'll end up broke.
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Uncle Mike
Advanced Member

USA
1603 Posts

Posted - February 03 2016 :  10:28:33 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi, I know this will surprise my friends but......COLT, regards, Mike

"The secret of happiness is freedom, and the secret of freedom, courage"...Thucyides

"War is sweet to those who do not know it."...Erasmus
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FORT CHAFFEE
Advanced Member

USA
1375 Posts

Posted - February 04 2016 :  08:54:37 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I failed to put a price point in my post but about 600-900. This idea of a 1911 may send me back to shoot I.D.P.A. I used it to test new stuff and it worked for me. Thanks for the post. i need current information on the 1911's so i can buy one that is made well now.
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Uncle Mike
Advanced Member

USA
1603 Posts

Posted - February 04 2016 :  08:59:34 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi, I was wondering if they were all the same price,which would you buy? The difference of a few hundred dollars doesn't mean much over a lifetime. Good luck to you,regards, mike

"The secret of happiness is freedom, and the secret of freedom, courage"...Thucyides

"War is sweet to those who do not know it."...Erasmus
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FORT CHAFFEE
Advanced Member

USA
1375 Posts

Posted - February 04 2016 :  09:00:44 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Sorry i also need to add if i failed to put a brand of 1911 that someone likes in my list post what you like and why. Thanks for the great post. I've been out of 1911's for some time and need to be updated.
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Badge
Advanced Member

USA
1648 Posts

Posted - February 04 2016 :  11:41:42 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
My first Ruger went back and was destroyed. My second Commander works fine. My Colt works fine out of the box.

MSS
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FORT CHAFFEE
Advanced Member

USA
1375 Posts

Posted - February 04 2016 :  3:23:10 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Uncle Mike thanks for the question. I'm old school when it comes to 1911's. Back in the day you had Colt and then brand X. If i were to pick one it would be the Colt. My problem is that Colt has had problems in the past few years and i don't know if they are still "the" 1911. At the 2016 shot show they had some new models that look good on You Tube. I was able to look at one the Competitor at a gun shop in my town. It looks well made but the sights are a question. I may need to swap them for something i can see better. The light weight commander is also back this year for about the same money. I think the Competitor may be what i'm looking for i'm just not sure. I want to keep a open mind to new 1911's. I may be a old dog but, you know how that goes. Thanks...........
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gw
Advanced Member

3983 Posts

Posted - February 04 2016 :  4:05:37 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
you didn't ask about them, but I'd definitely take a look at a SW1911, their version of the external extractor works

"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not..."
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Uncle Mike
Advanced Member

USA
1603 Posts

Posted - February 04 2016 :  4:09:16 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by FORT CHAFFEE

My problem is that Colt has had problems in the past few years and i don't know if they are still "the" 1911.... It looks well made but the sights are a question. I may need to swap them for something i can see better. The light weight commander is also back this year for about the same money. I think the Competitor may be what i'm looking for i'm just not sure. I want to keep a open mind to new 1911's. I may be a old dog but, you know how that goes. Thanks...........



Hi,just my take on this. I used to be a "gun pimp" ie. sold firearms at a big box store. It was a part time job after I retired. I learned that most of "our" salesmen hunted once a year, maybe and knew less than your average boy scout. I heard " Colt is going out of business". "Colt is having quality control problems, etc." I have never had a problem with Colt; your/others experience may vary.

I have had real QC problems with Springfield Inc. and absolutely would not ever buy a Kimber. Your/ others may love your Kimbers,they are the most popular. The salesman's job is to sell you something; usually what he has in stock.

As for sights I can't see like I used to. My most visible sights have been those that are white. The white bead on the Colt XSE, Govt. and Cmdr. and the Mk III Browning HP,work for me. How do I know? I can hit what I aim at including cloverleaf groups. When I qualified with my SIG 226 with night sights the range guy complimented me, 2 years in a row.

I like Colt's forged parts. See my post "What makes a Colt". My partner loves his high line Springfield Inc. Me, not so much, I'm stuck with fixing them. He has sent two Springfield's back due to frame and slide problems.

Before any ones feelings get hurt I'd like to say that I'm no expert,nor do I play one on the internet. So your experience may be different than mine,or YMMV. Good Luck on your retirement,regards, Mike

PS: I forgot to mention I have no experience with the S&W, Ruger,or new Remington, but did play with a SIG 1911,"factory reconditioned". It had the sweetest trigger I ever used.It also had an exposed extractor,which was new to me,in a 1911

"The secret of happiness is freedom, and the secret of freedom, courage"...Thucyides

"War is sweet to those who do not know it."...Erasmus

Edited by - Uncle Mike on February 04 2016 4:15:59 PM
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JACKSP
Starting Member

USA
39 Posts

Posted - February 04 2016 :  6:27:07 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I bought a blue Colt Commander 2 years ago. I have about 2000 rounds through it without any malfunctions.
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khclark
Senior Member

632 Posts

Posted - February 09 2016 :  12:22:46 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
S&W is not on your list, but I'll tell you about mine: I had a fixed sight SW1911 from first year of production (2003, I believe) and still have an adjustable sight SW1911 from second year of production. Both have been great: accurate, reliable, and durable, but were pricey (almost $1000 IIRC). Just a sample size of two, but a good trend. Production has long since been moved from Springfield MA to Houlton ME - so I can't speak to current production. I have been eyeing a Comander size bobtail E-series for a few years though (much $$$).

revolvers: anachronistic yet efficacious
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Jim Higginbotham
Moderator

USA
9431 Posts

Posted - February 11 2016 :  1:06:55 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by FORT CHAFFEE

I'm retired now and i have more time to shoot. The problem is i don't know who makes the best 1911 for the money. I don't think this will be a carry gun as i have too many years in with my Glock 19. I just love to shoot a 1911. What does the forum think? Thanks.



It is hard to beat a Colt but I sort of prefer the ones without firing pin safeties - which means just a tad over your price limit - a Series 70 "reproduction" will cost close to $1000 (if you shop around).

Springfield Armory, Ruger, Dan Wesson and even CZ-USA make true to form guns.

Right now I'd put Ruger as the best value on those but the others are really good.

Jim

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Uncle Mike
Advanced Member

USA
1603 Posts

Posted - February 11 2016 :  1:41:04 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jim Higginbotham




It is hard to beat a Colt but I sort of prefer the ones without firing pin safeties - which means just a tad over your price limit - a Series 70 "reproduction" will cost close to $1000 (if you shop around).
Jim
[/quote]

Hi Jim, I remember hearing Col.Cooper talk about the danger of dropping the 1911 and ending up with a bullet under your chin. This may have happened to Melvin Purvis. The 80 series which has the firing pin block can have the extra parts removed;there is even a YouTube on how to do it. I have heard that the extra safety will effect the trigger pull. I have shot and own both 70 and 80 series and I see no difference.(YMMV) My only complaint is that my Colt 22 conversion only fits on the 70 series. I'm not advocating disconnecting any safety, regards, Mike

"The secret of happiness is freedom, and the secret of freedom, courage"...Thucyides

"War is sweet to those who do not know it."...Erasmus

Edited by - Uncle Mike on February 11 2016 1:41:49 PM
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gw
Advanced Member

3983 Posts

Posted - February 11 2016 :  3:01:29 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I've taken the firing pin safety out of series 80s and couldn't tell a difference, the Swartz system the early S&W 1911s had could cause light primer strikes though over time, I don't care for that at all.

"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not..."
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Steve in Michigan
Junior Member

USA
153 Posts

Posted - February 11 2016 :  4:12:53 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Ruger solves the firing pin problem by putting in a titanium firing pin that is too light to go off if the pistol is dropped. So, it has a great trigger without the risk.
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Jim Higginbotham
Moderator

USA
9431 Posts

Posted - February 15 2016 :  09:42:15 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Uncle Mike

quote:
Originally posted by Jim Higginbotham




It is hard to beat a Colt but I sort of prefer the ones without firing pin safeties - which means just a tad over your price limit - a Series 70 "reproduction" will cost close to $1000 (if you shop around).
Jim



Hi Jim, I remember hearing Col.Cooper talk about the danger of dropping the 1911 and ending up with a bullet under your chin. This may have happened to Melvin Purvis. The 80 series which has the firing pin block can have the extra parts removed;there is even a YouTube on how to do it. I have heard that the extra safety will effect the trigger pull. I have shot and own both 70 and 80 series and I see no difference.(YMMV) My only complaint is that my Colt 22 conversion only fits on the 70 series. I'm not advocating disconnecting any safety, regards, Mike

[/quote]

Actually I think he said something like it would be nearly impossible to do that - He explained that if the gun falls butt down then it strikes the hammer on any hard surface - which actually forced the hammer backwards on a 1911 if it is cocked (I've actually seen him demonstrate that) - of course most modern guns do not have a spur hammer and a standard grip safety and they land on the back of the grip safety.

The way a 1911 *can* go off is if it is dropped and the muzzle strikes the hard surface pointed straight down - which is not only unusual at heights of less than 8 feet but if it does go off there is normally minimal damage to surrounding appendages.

The Govt. has contrived a device to drop one from a height of around 12 feet to strike on the muzzle (one dropped with no guidance almost always does not land with the muzzle pointing straight down). The standard Colt Govt. Model can go off that way but most other companies now use smaller and lighter firing pins and heavier FP springs and they will pass the 12 foot test.

Jim

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FORT CHAFFEE
Advanced Member

USA
1375 Posts

Posted - February 15 2016 :  12:38:12 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Jim thanks for the information. From what the gun shop owners tell me they sale the Rugers as fast as they can get them. I was told by a gun shop owner Colt has cut the price on some of the new models. Would you rather have a Colt for about the same money? Thanks..........
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Uncle Mike
Advanced Member

USA
1603 Posts

Posted - February 15 2016 :  4:42:37 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote


quote:
Originally posted by Jim Higginbotham





Actually I think he said something like it would be nearly impossible to do that - He explained that if the gun falls butt down then it strikes the hammer on any hard surface - which actually forced the hammer backwards on a 1911 if it is cocked (I've actually seen him demonstrate that) - of course most modern guns do not have a spur hammer and a standard grip safety and they land on the back of the grip safety.
[/quote]



Hi Jim ,I'm getting my information from a talk he gave and included in the DVD series, " Jeff Cooper's Defensive Pistol Craft Tape Series", Paladin Press. He actually points under his chin, regards, Mike

"The secret of happiness is freedom, and the secret of freedom, courage"...Thucyides

"War is sweet to those who do not know it."...Erasmus
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stykshooter
Starting Member

17 Posts

Posted - February 16 2016 :  01:00:02 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Between my own guns and those of some of my shooting buddies, I get the opportunity to play with numerous pistols that will fall into your price range. One thing that I have learned is that 1911's can be finicky. Two identical guns from the same maker can be on opposite ends of the spectrum in terms of performance.

I have shot two of the Ruger 1911's and can't find anything wrong with either of them. They were both reasonably accurate and each had a few hiccups, as you would expect from a new weapon until it was broken in. I guess I am old school though and it is hard for me to get into an all stainless 1911. They oughta be blued.

I had a Springfield Range Officer for a month or so. I really wanted this gun and wanted to like it. Nicely made with adjustable sights and shot ball ammo well. When I tried to feed it my cast 185 and 200 grain loads it jammed up on me about every 4 or 5 shots. I bought it used from a guy who was having the same issues and thought that I could fix the feeding problems. Lots of time in the gun polishing and stoning and still had issues.

Both of my sons have Remington 1911's. Not the entry level guns but the R-1 Enhanced. They sell for about $800.00 and seem to be a great value. Both of their pistols are dependable and very accurate. They look to be a real well made gun and both my sons love theirs.

I currently have three Kimbers. One is 20 years old, another ten years old. A Custom and a Custom Royal. Both of those guns have been outstanding... feed most anything I load in a mag and accurate as any other pistol I have shot. My old Custom will put a full magazine of rounds in your business card at 20 yards using a 185 grain cast bullet over a stout load of Herco.

I recently bought a new Kimber Custom II two tone a couple of months back. This is a relatively inexpensive pistol that sells for around $700.00. I have been very impressed with this particular pistol. I had some issues at first with feeding. I had stuck a Brownells recoil buffer in it when I first got the pistol, as I do on all of my 1911's. I had several stove pipe jams with the pistol so I removed the buffer. No problems since. This gun will shoot either my pet hand load of a 200 grain cast semi wadcutter over WW 231 or C.C.I. 200 grain factory Gold Dot into 1.5-2" at 20 yards all day. I may have just gotten a very good example but this is an impressive gun.

A real surprise to me has been some of the Sigarms 1911's. I have had a Scorpion and a second model that I think was the FastBack on the range. I think that they both sell for under $900.00. I don't care for the desert tan coloration of the Scorpion but both of these guns were exceedingly accurate in the hands of a half dozen shooters. The Scorpion was scary accurate. I shot five rounds at 25 yards resting on a barricade into a ragged hole the size of a 35 mm film canister lid. Everyone made the comment that either of these guns were more accurate than anything we had shot until you get into the pricey guns like a Les Bauer, Wilson or Dan Wesson.

I haven't gotten the chance to play with the new Colt competition pistol but that will probably be my next 1911 purchase. Seems to be a nice package at an attractive price point. I have owned three full sized Colt 1911's over the years and each turned out to be a huge disappointment. Feeding and accuracy problems. I did have a Combat Commander that was an outstanding pistol. I hope they have all of that worked out in the new model.
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Jim Higginbotham
Moderator

USA
9431 Posts

Posted - February 16 2016 :  10:16:13 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by FORT CHAFFEE

Jim thanks for the information. From what the gun shop owners tell me they sale the Rugers as fast as they can get them. I was told by a gun shop owner Colt has cut the price on some of the new models. Would you rather have a Colt for about the same money? Thanks..........



That is a real dilemma - I'd not hesitate to buy a Colt Series 70 for the same money but the ones they cut the price on is a Series 80

A real tough call and I would not fault anyone for going either way.

The Ruger has MIM internals (which are easily replaced) but it has great features like good sights, beavertail, and the best thumb safety in the business

Colt has forged internals, decent sights (though I would replace the rear as they look sorta flimsy) but it also has the Firing Pin safety - that is not a "show stopper" for me but it is a distraction - typically I just toss that stuff but that is just me.

Jim

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lashlaruhe
Starting Member

USA
30 Posts

Posted - February 16 2016 :  10:51:21 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I have owned 9 Colt made 1911's, beginning in 1967. Of the 9 about 5 had some type poblem, Front sight loose, front sight gone with the wind, recoil spring tunnel off center frame tunnel rub, recoil spring plug AWOL while shooting. My problem with Colt is that they have been manufacturing them the longest and still have to many Friday afternoon before vacation, Monday morningf first day after Christmas vacation 1911's to blanket recommend them over some others. I had 2each Blue Govt models, 1 each Gold Cup, 1 each LW commander, 1 each Colt Officers Model, 1 each SS rail Model of 100 year model, 1 each Series 70 100 year model and 1 each SS series 80 Bovt (still have this one)
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FORT CHAFFEE
Advanced Member

USA
1375 Posts

Posted - February 16 2016 :  3:51:38 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Guys thanks for all the great post. This is what i was looking fore first hand experience.
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Nanuk
Senior Member

USA
813 Posts

Posted - February 21 2016 :  8:40:28 PM  Show Profile  Click to see Nanuk's MSN Messenger address  Reply with Quote
An engineer did a test some years back with a Colt slide and concluded that it was not possible to detonate a primer when dropped muzzle down from about 23 feet. Lawyers have their own rules though.

"May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't." Gen. George Patton
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