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Jim Higginbotham
Moderator
USA
6231 Posts |
 Posted - July 05 2009 : 12:33:09 PM
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Yes!
But allow me to qualify that. It seems to me that most folks carry a gun with the idea of responding to the *typical* lethal threat (whatever that may be). And I would say that a good shot armed with a 5 or 6 shot revolver has a good chance of surviving that event, given a reasonable level of awareness and skill.
But I have always thought of responding to the worst case, within reason. I dont pay much attention to the "EOWAWKI or "Attack of the Zombies" but rather just the "really bad day" when I run into 3 well armed and fairly skilled sociopaths type of situation.
So, yes I would feel under-armed with *a* revolver in such a situation. I would not feel under-armed with 3 (2 of them being in a caiber larger than .357 magnum) for the situations I want to be prepared for. I could even live with 2 .357s it just would not be my choice. Having used them in the field a lot they dont inspire a lot of awe - but shot with precision they will do.
OTOH, for about 90% of lethal encounters a revolver will get you through if you know what you are doing. I note that the same argument would convince folks that they did not need to wear a seat belt or carry a fire extinquisher in their vehicle (I have used the latter twice in 44 years of driving).
Jim H. |
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gumshoe4
Junior Member
211 Posts |
Posted - July 06 2009 : 10:58:53 AM
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I carry a Sig on duty, but would not feel under-gunned with the right type of revolver based on our usual work scenario...the right type being a S&W K or L frame 2.5-4" .357 loaded with 125-gr JHP. We're prohibited from carrying backup firearms, but if I could do so, I would carry either my 649 or my SP101, regardless of which primary firearm I'm carrying...
Bob |
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Biggfoot44
Advanced Member
1713 Posts |
Posted - July 07 2009 : 02:48:07 AM
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| Does "underarmed" refer to carrying the scond revolver in Safariland upside down holster ? |
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jle3030
Advanced Member
USA
2537 Posts |
Posted - July 07 2009 : 07:33:02 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Biggfoot44
Does "underarmed" refer to carrying the scond revolver in Safariland upside down holster ?
Only if it shifts so far to the rear that you can barely reach the thing.  I don't know about the Safariland, but I've found that to be an issue with J-frames in my Bianchi 9R.
Jeff |
jle3030 |
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Reloader
Average Member
267 Posts |
Posted - July 07 2009 : 11:56:16 AM
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Only if it shifts so far to the rear that you can barely reach the thing. I don't know about the Safariland, but I've found that to be an issue with J-frames in my Bianchi 9R.
Jeff
I solved the problem with mine by using a safety pin through the harness and pinned to my shirt to prevent that from happeing. Been doing that for years.. |
NRA LIFE MEMBER
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When Xerxes, commander of the Persian army, 50,000 strong, demanded that Leonidas, the King of Sparta, and his 300 warriors, lay down their weapons and be saved, Leonidas Called back, "Molon Labe!" (Come and get them!")
Battle of Thermopylae
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jle3030
Advanced Member
USA
2537 Posts |
Posted - July 07 2009 : 6:36:49 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Reloader
Only if it shifts so far to the rear that you can barely reach the thing. I don't know about the Safariland, but I've found that to be an issue with J-frames in my Bianchi 9R.
Jeff
I solved the problem with mine by using a safety pin through the harness and pinned to my shirt to prevent that from happeing. Been doing that for years..
A PEARL! Thanks! 
Jeff |
jle3030 |
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Evan
Administrator
27518 Posts |
Posted - July 07 2009 : 6:58:06 PM
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my "typical" gunfights were never very typical-my partners were fond of telling me that my Guardian Angel would need to take a stress retirement.  |
"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."
Harold B. Lee
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NE450No2
New Member
77 Posts |
Posted - July 08 2009 : 01:01:25 AM
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Just today I had to make a quick trip in to town.
I carried my BUG, a S&W Mod 38, and my S&W 325 Night Guard.
I did not feel under gunned.
Of course I carried 48 extra 45 ACP rounds in full moon clips in my pocket. |
Edited by - NE450No2 on July 08 2009 01:03:12 AM |
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fatbaldguy
Junior Member
USA
243 Posts |
Posted - July 08 2009 : 9:39:07 PM
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| No, but you might want to establish some minimum level of carry. Mine is two guns and 20 rds. |
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Evan
Administrator
27518 Posts |
Posted - July 08 2009 : 9:43:45 PM
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| mine is three guns and 71 rnds |
"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."
Harold B. Lee
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remington
Junior Member
183 Posts |
Posted - July 10 2009 : 01:13:26 AM
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| The wheel guns are alive and kicking in LE field. They just have switched to a bug, second gun or off duty carry. Granted the autos rules the roost but the wheel guns are still there. I carried a Snubby as a back up for a few years then switched to a baby GLOCK when we switched to em cause it just made sense with being able to use the same mags and ammo. Kel-Tec as a 3rd tucked in my pocket holster. |
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Nobby42d
Average Member
USA
334 Posts |
Posted - August 11 2009 : 02:00:43 AM
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Don't really feel undergunned with just a revolver, since we all know it'll handle most SD situations. Right?
But, there's a nagging little voice in my head that says things might not be "most situations", and I carry at least a P220 (2 spare mag.s) and a 642 (still undergunned in some folks view). If not the P220, then likely a P229 .40.
Haven't graduated to 3 guns yet. |
We've got 'em now boys! George A. Custer, June 25th,1876--Little Bighorn, Mont. |
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Gary1911A1
Starting Member
USA
34 Posts |
Posted - August 11 2009 : 12:51:31 PM
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| Given 100% reliability is a must in any defensive pistol, the 125 grain .357 JHPs' impressive stopping power, and most of us being good shots, I think anyone of us would be well armed with a good quality .357 revolver. We are not typical of most LE and armed citizens though. At the prison where I use to work I was Top Gun. An mature man with eyes to match, but the young officers never seemed to understand trigger control. Massad Ayoob has an interesting book called "The Police Service Automatic" or something to that effect in which he makes a case for the average officer being able to shoot an auto better than a revolver, especially under stress. For the average officer I believe an auto will serve them better. For us, we would likely be just as better off with a revolver especially where reliability is concerned. |
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Chris Christian
Junior Member
USA
132 Posts |
Posted - August 11 2009 : 2:11:42 PM
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| I carried a Navy issue S&W M10 (with anemic Mil issue FMJ ammo) for six months in Vietnam as a Special Boat Unit crewman, and then on security duty in another SE Asia country. Had to use it once. It worked. I also shoot a revolver in IDPA competition and have won Regional and International trophies with it. But, today, I would not feel well armed with a single six shot revolver. Add a second revolver (snubby works) and I feel a lot better. Give me a semi-auto and a snubby, and I feel a lot better than that. If the SD situation is one knucklehead... yeah... a six shot revolver should work. Given the fact that there may be more than one, and I don't want to test my speed reload ability while fighting the others off. You can't have too many bullets in a fight. A single six shot gun doesn't do it for me. |
Chris Christian |
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BikerRN
Average Member
382 Posts |
Posted - October 15 2009 : 04:14:26 AM
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When I carry, which is daily, my off duty carry this year has been a Hi Power and a J-Frame.
When I carry a revolver as a primary, the previous two years, I carried three guns and they were all revolvers. I would feel significantly underarmed with just one revolver but with two spares, not so much.
I keep going back to the revolver for some reason. What can I say, I started on them and I do love them. Would they be my first choice as "general issue" to the troops, no. Would they be my first choice for those that can demonstrate that they can shoot one, yes, if they wanted to.
Biker |
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haywood
Junior Member
172 Posts |
Posted - October 15 2009 : 07:27:39 AM
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| Since I got my first CCW Permit I began reading books from the various gun writers. Some ware along the way I found this Column. I have learned if you carry one Gun you should probably carry Two. At this stage I carry at least Two revolvers or One G26 and a Revolver. I also carry Reloads, a flashlight, Cell Phone, and Lock blade Knife. I carry all day every day and hope I never have to use the Firearms for anything but practice. When I carry the Revolvers I don't feel underfuned. I feel the first thing I would do is seek cover, then see what happens. I have no experience so I can't say for sure what would happen or what I would do. |
Edited by - haywood on October 15 2009 08:10:13 AM |
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Glenn
Senior Member
USA
964 Posts |
Posted - October 15 2009 : 8:13:12 PM
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| I don't feel under armed at all with my Smith M66 .357 four inch and it has proven it's worth in the deer woods a time or two I use Magtech 158 grain .38 specials in it for hunting and 125 grain Remington Golden Sabers for SD carry , but normally it's either the G19 or Browning HP MKIII. |
Semper Paratus |
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fiasconva
New Member
USA
55 Posts |
Posted - October 16 2009 : 4:22:02 PM
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| One of the things that I notice at my gun club's range is that the ones practicing with their carry revolvers always seem to very good and accurate with them. Some of those guys shoot very small groups at some pretty fair distances. Very impressive! |
"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not." Thomas Jefferson |
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BikerRN
Average Member
382 Posts |
Posted - October 16 2009 : 5:47:22 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by fiasconva
One of the things that I notice at my gun club's range is that the ones practicing with their carry revolvers always seem to very good and accurate with them. Some of those guys shoot very small groups at some pretty fair distances. Very impressive!
When you know you only have five or six rounds it does tend to make you make every shot count.
Biker |
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LtBlue425
Starting Member
37 Posts |
Posted - October 16 2009 : 10:12:27 PM
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Going off the last couple posts, I've noticed there's a big difference during realistic training (with those little paintballs that hurt!)between officers who grew up on revolvers vs autos. Generally, us older, revolver background guys wait for a clear shot while the auto "kids" tend to pop off more rounds. Not picking on the younger ones but I think having 15-17 rounds in hand gives them a sense of being able to miss more without the consequence of running dry sooner.
That's my take on it anyway. It's still stuck in my retirement eligible brain to make every shot count so I don't run dry. We switched to Glocks in 1991 so there's very few of us left that were indoctrinated with revolvers.
On the other hand one could maybe say waiting for that clear shot could create problems. Every shooting is different and there's the second guessing that follows...should have done this different or that different, fired too many rounds, didn't fire enough, etc, etc. |
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Adj1
Average Member
USA
387 Posts |
Posted - October 27 2009 : 12:56:32 PM
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| No, but what do I know? I, sirrah, are a one-gun Bozo! |
Democracy is two coyotes and a sheep debating the dinner menu. Liberty is a well armed sheep, willing to contest the outcome of the vote. |
Edited by - Adj1 on October 27 2009 1:02:33 PM |
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1917
New Member
55 Posts |
Posted - November 17 2009 : 11:35:15 PM
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| First active LEO issue duty weapon was Smith mod 15 and issue ammo 38 200gr lead RN. Not so hot but effective when remember the three principles of lethal force as our instructor would say. Shot placement, shot placement, and shot placement. Still carry revolver but updated the ammo. Might as well take the advantage. |
Edited by - 1917 on November 17 2009 11:37:01 PM |
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ENH
Starting Member
25 Posts |
Posted - November 18 2009 : 10:23:42 AM
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| When not carrying an auto as my primary, I favor an 8 shot 327, 8 rounds of 357 Powerball and 5 or 6 in the BUG is comforting. Of course somewhere there is the KT P3AT also. |
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GLV
Moderator
USA
8189 Posts |
Posted - November 18 2009 : 6:46:29 PM
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Today was a normal day--worked a few hours as I do a couple of days a week.
Carry was a 625-10 with DPX, a 296 with Win ST, and a 642 with DPX. The 625 strong side IWB in a Galco, the 296 Cross draw in a JIT, and the 642 left pocket in and old Null. all reloads were in Speed strips. |
'the world is round everywhere'
'The meek will inherit the earth, but only after the last soldier has left it to them in his will' |
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jle3030
Advanced Member
USA
2537 Posts |
Posted - November 19 2009 : 06:00:50 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by GLV
Today was a normal day--worked a few hours as I do a couple of days a week.
Carry was a 625-10 with DPX, a 296 with Win ST, and a 642 with DPX. The 625 strong side IWB in a Galco, the 296 Cross draw in a JIT, and the 642 left pocket in and old Null. all reloads were in Speed strips.
Question: I have no doubt you have worked out a system for this. Where do you carry the various speed strips and how do you stay habituated to which strip goes with which gun?
Jeff |
jle3030 |
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Topic |
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Anyone feel under-armed with a revolver?
