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Nicolas Deem
Average Member
456 Posts |
 Posted - November 29 2008 : 9:53:27 PM
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In Gary we are issued the following:
9mm 147 grain Ranger T or Gold Dots
40 Cal. 180 grain Ranger T or Gold Dot
45ACP 230 grain Ranger T or Gold Dot
It depends on what is available at the time.
Officers are that carry long guns have to buy their own ammo.
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"We don't go to work, we go to war."
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perrodelucha
Senior Member
USA
673 Posts |
Posted - November 30 2008 : 12:06:20 PM
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| when i was working there a glock 22 with 180gr gold dots. |
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Glenn
Senior Member
USA
792 Posts |
Posted - November 30 2008 : 2:49:23 PM
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| 180 grain Remington Golden Sabers w/ a Glock 22 and either Remington #4 buck or TAP #4 buck |
Semper Paratus |
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JWM
Junior Member
173 Posts |
Posted - November 30 2008 : 3:07:52 PM
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Federal .40 cal,155 grain JHP. Product #XM40HB. I think our sister agency in Border Patrol carries the same round. I have not heard anything bad about the round from the troops in the field. |
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Evan
Administrator
27006 Posts |
Posted - November 30 2008 : 4:37:02 PM
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Detroit-.38 RNL and 9MM win 115gr +p+&THV
The Feds I worked for-Win 230gr jhp-SXT |
"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."
Harold B. Lee
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fatbaldguy
Junior Member
USA
228 Posts |
Posted - November 30 2008 : 5:12:13 PM
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.357 Sig 125 gr Gold Dots
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BobM77
Advanced Member
USA
1032 Posts |
Posted - December 01 2008 : 12:27:05 PM
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| 180 grain Gold Dots for the M&P40s, Black Hills 60 gr Vmax and Fed. American Eagle 223 FMJ for the ARs, and low recoil 00 buck and slugs for the 870s. |
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Scotty
Starting Member
USA
24 Posts |
Posted - December 01 2008 : 1:54:30 PM
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9mm WW Ranger SXT 127 +P+
40 WW Ranger SXT 165
45 WW Ranger SXT 230 +P |
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Kevin
Advanced Member
USA
1626 Posts |
Posted - December 01 2008 : 2:55:54 PM
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We're switching from a horrible late 80s vintage 147 grain 9mm subsonic to .40 S&W, specifically Federal 155 grain JHP. We'll still use the crappy 9mm in our buzzguns, and for issue to people who hold onto their personally owned 9mm sidearms; but the official issue round is now the 155 gr .40 S&W.
Regards,
Kevin |
"Fast is fine, accuracy is final..." |
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wolfgang2000
Senior Member
USA
784 Posts |
Posted - December 01 2008 : 7:00:39 PM
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Upon retirement my Dept. issued Ranger SXT
9MM = 147 grn
40 = 180 grn
45 = 230 grn
After trying to get them to change the 9mm to some thing more effective, I decide the life of my wife and I were more important that the rules, and carried the Ranger 127 +P+. Luckily we never had to use them.
I understand that it's the issued 9MM round. |
“The key is to hit them hard, hit them fast, and hit them repeatedly. The one shot stop is a unit of measurement not a tactical philosophy.” Evan Marshall |
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gumshoe4
Junior Member
208 Posts |
Posted - December 01 2008 : 7:49:44 PM
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9mm: W-W 147-grain JHP white box "Personal Protection"
.40: Remington 180-grain Golden Saber JHP OR
Winchester 180-grain Ranger JHP
All the loads function reliably and are accurate through the issue sidearms (Sig 228/225 or Sig 229), but we haven't had a shooting in a long time (and I hope it stays that way!), so don't have personal knowledge about how well these rounds work on target.
Bob
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Arvinator
Advanced Member
USA
1296 Posts |
Posted - December 02 2008 : 2:14:35 PM
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Issue ammo for sidearms is Remington GS 165 in .40 caliber in Glock 22.
No shotguns or ammo issued, rifle is AR 15 with 55 grain ball (My own).
Backup weapons are private owned, as well as ammo for them. |
Be honest, fair, and always prepared... |
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Deputy25
Average Member
USA
407 Posts |
Posted - December 02 2008 : 6:20:29 PM
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| Winchester Ranger T 125 grain HP .357 SIG for the Glock 31 and 33. Winchester Ranger low-recoil 00 buck and slugs for the 870. |
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Keith
Advanced Member
USA
2511 Posts |
Posted - December 02 2008 : 6:27:49 PM
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165-grain Federal Tactical "Bonded" jhp in .40 S&W caliber. Shoots straight, burns clean, has yet to ever fail to expand. We've got some 155 and 165-grain Federal HST jhp ammo out with some units, on a trial basis of sorts, since the beancounters are fretting about the "expense" of the Tactical Bonded service ammo.
If politics stays out of the next big ammo purchase, we'll stay with the 165-grain Tactical Bonded. If it ain't broke, no need to "fix" it...and it sure's heck ain't broke.
Officers carrying 9mm's for off-duty, BUG or plainclothes are given whatever they got on hand at the armory, since 9mm's a secondary caliber. Right now it's the same load the SRT guys use in their buzz-guns, Federal 135-grain +P Tactical "Bonded" jhp. They've finally used up all the 147-grain ammo they had. It actually worked pretty well...I just never saw the sense of downloading a perfectly good 9mm to .38 Special levels. |
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Nicolas Deem
Average Member
456 Posts |
Posted - December 02 2008 : 6:58:51 PM
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| So I take that the bonded HST rounds stay together pretty good huh? So do they work better than the standard HST rounds? It seems that half of our recent shootings have a vehicle involved. They try to run us over than shoot at us here recently. I need something that will stay together going through windshields. |
"We don't go to work, we go to war."
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Keith
Advanced Member
USA
2511 Posts |
Posted - December 02 2008 : 8:39:22 PM
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| Federal's Tactical "Bonded" line will do the trick for you then. Plus it'll expand reliably in straight up anti-personnel shootings. It's not often you find a bullet that will handle hard barriers well, and still expand reliably on soft targets. Cor-Bon's DPX loads and most of the Speer Gold Dot line up will do the same. |
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dubiousone
Average Member
263 Posts |
Posted - December 02 2008 : 9:32:39 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Nicolas Deem
So I take that the bonded HST rounds stay together pretty good huh? So do they work better than the standard HST rounds? It seems that half of our recent shootings have a vehicle involved. They try to run us over than shoot at us here recently. I need something that will stay together going through windshields.
Choose a bonded bullet like the Federal or Gold Dot. Both perform excepotionally well through windshield glass. Remember to move as you shoot, engaging the driver successfully only succeeds in turning the vehicle into an unguided moving object..... |
Expert? I ain't no expert, just a
Reasonably Knowledgeable Individual... |
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Evan
Administrator
27006 Posts |
Posted - December 02 2008 : 10:17:52 PM
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| all HST are the same-Tactical is a different bullet-have a couple of boxes of 165 grain Tactical-good stuff. |
"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."
Harold B. Lee
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nightlighter12
Senior Member
USA
903 Posts |
Posted - December 03 2008 : 10:48:08 AM
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| Working armed security, when I carried a .357 it was 125grJHP. After switching to 9mm it was progressive; WW 115gr STHP, Corbon 115gr+P then Corbon 115grDPX+P. Company issues .38 and stuff I'd rather not talk about. |
Chance favors the prepared mind. Louis Pasture |
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Nicolas Deem
Average Member
456 Posts |
Posted - December 03 2008 : 6:50:13 PM
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| What does HST stand for? And when did it come out? I never heard of it till a couple of years ago. |
"We don't go to work, we go to war."
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Evan
Administrator
27006 Posts |
Posted - December 03 2008 : 7:09:09 PM
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| no idea-another one of Tom Burznski's great ideas-he also invented Hydra Shok, Quik Shok, and Star Fire-he's a genuinely neat human being-very down to earth. |
"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."
Harold B. Lee
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Nicolas Deem
Average Member
456 Posts |
Posted - December 03 2008 : 7:45:11 PM
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| I looked up the ballistics on the bonded HST on there web site. The 165 grain is kinda slow, 1050fps, compared to the standard 165 grain HST's 1160fps. That has to be a miss print; I can't imagine that they would water down 165 grain bonded round. The next time I purchase ammo for me and the boys I will buy the Bonded HST rounds. |
"We don't go to work, we go to war."
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enidpd804
Advanced Member
1065 Posts |
Posted - December 03 2008 : 11:02:23 PM
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| Rumor is: High Shock Two, HST. I couldn't find anything on ATK or Federal websites about what it stood for. |
Warren |
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Nicolas Deem
Average Member
456 Posts |
Posted - December 04 2008 : 12:25:20 AM
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| Yeah I heard Hydra Shok Tactical. But I have been unable to find anything that supports it. |
"We don't go to work, we go to war."
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Keith
Advanced Member
USA
2511 Posts |
Posted - December 04 2008 : 10:38:07 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Nicolas Deem
I looked up the ballistics on the bonded HST on there web site. The 165 grain is kinda slow, 1050fps, compared to the standard 165 grain HST's 1160fps. That has to be a miss print; I can't imagine that they would water down 165 grain bonded round.
You are quite correct on the velocity. The lots we get usually clock about 1,035 fps or a bit more from a Glock 22.
After three and a half decades of police work, I have no love for a "subsonic" anything when it comes to defensive handgun ammo. While speed doesn't always "kill" it sure as heck increases the likelihood of a channel change when we're talking about winning a handgun fight. A channel change allows you to rob time from your attacker at spitting distances, right when you need it most and he can stand losing it the least. I'm really hard-core about that, almost bitterly so, and I doubt I'll ever change.
But as we all know, you gotta hit 'em to hurt 'em...and thus the load you have to select for your entire agency often becomes a compromise between what you need and what your people can pick up and shoot well. We've used the 165-grain Tactical Bonded in Indianapolis since Federal started marketing it a dozen or more years ago. Knock on wood, it has never failed to terminate a fight with a decently-placed hit or two. Every time there's been a problem, we've found it involved the BG being hit in the thigh, or arm, or buttock, etc.
If this tells you anything (and it should), once we starting issuing that load, and got some field use out of it, everybody stopped complaining about our issued ammo. They complain about shotguns, comp time, patrol rifles, laptops, quartermaster, night court, and communications...but our service handgun ammo is a non-issue. Watch the front sight, press the trigger straight to the rear and it will do as much as you can reasonably expect any handgun ammo to do...which, all things considered, is pretty good.
Would I like a full-house 165-grain muzzle velocity of 1,150 fps? You betcha...and I could handle it because I'm a committed shooter. Still...the hard fact is that we have admin spuds who won't finance the training that's needed and we have personnel who'll only shoot when you order them to the range. If you think about it a moment, it always seems like its those types who blunder into a situation were there's gunplay. You rarely get a gunfight involving one of those switched on, squared-away troops who pays his own way for extra training and shows up at the department's range every week wanting you to give him more free range ammo to shoot.
But we gotta train and equip everybody to survive, right? The committed shooters and the not-so-committed. Make 'em all come home safe at the end of every shift. So we make "compromises" in caliber and load selection and we try our best to make it work within the parameters we're stuck with. You've been dealing with that for years, I know. The 165-grain Bonded load is one of those that can be a good choice. At least it has here, and we've used it a bunch on some hard people. |
Edited by - Keith on December 04 2008 10:51:06 AM |
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gumshoe4
Junior Member
208 Posts |
Posted - December 04 2008 : 11:09:49 AM
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Well said and very true...
Bob |
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Topic |
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What type of Duty Ammo are you issued?
