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Evan
Administrator

34116 Posts

Posted - May 05 2008 :  10:06:21 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
We routinely have folks post here that they have bought a Farnsknobble 24X9.47MM and 80,000 rnds of ammo for self defense and try and find somebody here to reassure them.

Frankly, this is not www.feelgood.com. Everyone here is ready and willing to make recommendations and offer help but once you've bought the clunker we're not going to gush and fawn over you.

I carry what I like and expect everyone else to do the same and will defend your right to do so, but its frustrating to see people get bamboozled by a gun shop commando when a few simple questions asked here would eliminate alot of heartburn.

Frankly, much of our knowledge has come from really stupid decisions BUT why repeat them?

"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."

Harold B. Lee

Doc Lee
Advanced Member

USA
1284 Posts

Posted - May 05 2008 :  10:33:38 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Evan, you make an excellent point here. There are some gun shop owners and employees who do offer "good advise." On the other hand, I've listened to unmitigated crap being presented as well worn fact to customers. You are correct about a person's having made a purchase and trying to find support for their decision. The advice needs to precede the purchase, not help justify a MK IV boomenloudly. Nuanced advice from Jim H., for example, carries a lot of weight based upon his experience and background.

It needs to be understood that what is right for Evan and what is right Doc Lee might be entirely different. Does that make our choices wrong? Nope, we've both had the opportunity to learn what works well for us. This information is gleaned from experience and listening to those who have experience in dealing with the situations we may confront. Those who have found out, from experience and research, what is reliable, effective, and works well for them can have a role in advising others. Said advice should be informational rather than a specific dogma when dealing with purchase or advice about usage of specific firearms(s).

This advice is particularly germane when it deals with having learned the hard way that a MK III boomer is unreliable and not something we'd care to repeat our earlier experiences with.

Doc Lee
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ACME - Weapons Division
Senior Member

700 Posts

Posted - May 05 2008 :  2:34:51 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
*sniff* But I LIKE the Farnsknobble 24X9.47MM . . .

Field Testing Engineer
ACME - Weapons Division
"ACME, the Name You Can Trust!"
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Ace
Advanced Member

USA
5050 Posts

Posted - May 05 2008 :  2:47:56 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
And I'm keeping my Mk IV Boomenloudly, if for no other reason than to show novices why they shouldn't get one for themselves.

Real good points, Evan and Doc. You've said what I've been thinking for a long time. Thanks. Ace

Give me $1 every time a Liberal lies, I'll give you $5 every time one tells the truth; I'll end up a wealthy man, you'll end up broke.
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Evan
Administrator

34116 Posts

Posted - May 05 2008 :  5:24:36 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Acme? do you have the one with the scadnium nargenfargle?

"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."

Harold B. Lee

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Doc Lee
Advanced Member

USA
1284 Posts

Posted - May 05 2008 :  5:34:58 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Evan, mine has racing stripes. Does yours?
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Evan
Administrator

34116 Posts

Posted - May 05 2008 :  5:48:08 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Puce Flames with frosted highlights

"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."

Harold B. Lee

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Matthew Courtney
Advanced Member

USA
1220 Posts

Posted - May 05 2008 :  6:14:33 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
If life was a bad decision contest, I'd win. The trick is to make original poor choices, not the same ones over and over.

You will never begin in the fight you have planned for. You will begin in the fight the other guy has planned for.
Move in a manner that leads him into your fight should he press his attack.
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Evan
Administrator

34116 Posts

Posted - May 05 2008 :  6:34:28 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I tell people it could have been alot worse-I could have been twins.

"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."

Harold B. Lee

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garrettwc
Advanced Member

1017 Posts

Posted - May 05 2008 :  11:08:28 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think a lot of people go through three phases of justification

Stage One - they read every gun magazine they can until they decide which pistol is the "cool gun of the month" then go to their favorite internet resource seeking justification for the purchase.

Stage two - they have spent some time on the internet, competed in IDPA or IPSC, are considered an "expert" by the folks in Stage One and they spend all their time trying to justify to others that they have chosen the best tactiblaster 1000 model.

Stage three - they have been through the real thing and lived to tell about it, or have been fortunate enough to find a resource like we have here, and have become confident enough in their skills that they don't need justification. They see every gun as a tool, and know it will do the job if they do their part.

"Let us speak courteously, deal fairly, and keep ourselves armed and ready."
Teddy Roosevelt - San Francisco, CA, May 13, 1903
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BobK
Advanced Member

USA
1983 Posts

Posted - May 06 2008 :  12:05:18 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
It amazes me to see the number of people that spend untold amounts of money before doing any research. The local gun shops are full of used guns that these very people bring back. Gun shop owners love to see these people coming.


The caliber of the man counts more than the caliber of his gun.
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enidpd804
Advanced Member

1758 Posts

Posted - May 06 2008 :  12:45:54 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Great post Garrett. My first choice in a defensive handgun was a Charter 38...which was actually okay and all that I could afford at 14. I still have it.

My next was a Smith 1006. After nothing but trouble and two trips back to the factory, I traded it for a Beretta 92 which I used in the police academy. Thousands of trouble free rounds later (not a single malfunction), I went to a Beretta 96 which also gave me a few thousand rounds of perfect performance. (I'll keep it forever because it is a 'Police Special' given to me by my parents as a gift for graduating the academy.)

Briefly, I had a 1911 from one of the big (if not the biggest) names in the business. It wouldn't even feed 230 ball reliably and it got sent back twice. Thankfully, the company is known for its service and refunded my money. I went back to the 96. Stories of short life of the 40 caliber Berettas and a move to a different department with different rules got me persuaded into a Glock 22 which I would have never touched several years earlier. It's still my duty gun (+/-9 years). It hasn't been perfect, but it has certainly been a workhorse.

In short, my two most expensive and glamorous defensive handguns have been crap. I've got more than a few handguns, but only a few for defense. They're ugly, but they work and nothing else really matters. Live and learn.

Warren

Edited by - enidpd804 on May 06 2008 12:48:03 AM
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ACME - Weapons Division
Senior Member

700 Posts

Posted - May 06 2008 :  09:27:03 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Evan

Acme? do have the one with the scadnium nargenfargle?



I was on the beta test group for it. Things didn't work out too well. Recoil was excessive (I had three corrective operations on my hand afterwards), muzzle blast set the range on fire (and my nostril hair with the comp version), and the cylinder locked up whenever I used Illudium Q-38 loads due to the projectiles coming loose under recoil.

Stick with the hammer forged Damascus steel versions. They are more controllable (barely), and look really cool. Chicks dig 'em.

FYI,

John

Field Testing Engineer
ACME - Weapons Division
"ACME, the Name You Can Trust!"
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Evan
Administrator

34116 Posts

Posted - May 06 2008 :  09:36:21 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
at my age the only Chick that digs me is the Grandmother of my Grandchildren which is way cool with me, Brother.

The minute I saw the gun on the cover of Blood&Guts Magazine I knew I had to have one-after all, Wally The Gun Whore gave it a five star review after shooting 412,000,000 round thru it in 24 hrs.

"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."

Harold B. Lee

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whiskeymike
Average Member

USA
285 Posts

Posted - May 06 2008 :  10:19:03 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I hope this is not deemed off-topic but this is, I believe a phenomenon not limited to firearms.
Check out the ads for :
Low-mileage hot sports cars;
Low time high performance airplanes;
Low time high performance boats ( or large boats ).
I think we see it, want it, buy it and then figure out we haven't a clue what it's all about.
If we're lucky, we get rid of it before it kills us.

Not that I would ever make any decisions like that

whiskeymike
Kennesaw, GA.
NRA Life Member
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Evan
Administrator

34116 Posts

Posted - May 06 2008 :  10:58:13 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
what I love is why people never ask if this _______ is so great why are they selling it?

My wife, however, got a great deal on a like new Chrysler Pacificia-retired guy bought while he was in Mi for the summer-when he went to load it up to take stuff back to Florida for the winter he could not get as much it in as he could his old Mini Van, so he traded his 9 month old car in on a new Mini Van.

"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."

Harold B. Lee

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rgrassi
Starting Member

USA
48 Posts

Posted - May 06 2008 :  4:36:43 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Evan

The minute I was the gun on the cover of Blood&Guts Magazine I knew I had to have one-after all, Wally The Gun Whore gave it a five star review after shooting 412,000,000 round thru it in 24 hrs.



Sorry, the guns I reviewed didn't make the cover . . . oops! That wasn't about me was it?
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Evan
Administrator

34116 Posts

Posted - May 06 2008 :  5:53:14 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Chuck tells me you have your slutish moments but he likes me-so he's obviously got his internal GPS on upside down.

"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."

Harold B. Lee

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Reloader
Average Member

375 Posts

Posted - May 06 2008 :  10:56:49 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I believe it was Elmer Keith who said, "Beware of ther man with one gun; he will know how to use it." Please correct me if I am mistaken.

NRA LIFE MEMBER
NRA Pistol Instructor
Amateur License KE5LDO
ARRL, W5YI Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Instructor

When Xerxes, commander of the Persian army, 50,000 strong, demanded that Leonidas, the King of Sparta, and his 300 warriors, lay down their weapons and be saved, Leonidas Called back, "Molon Labe!" (Come and get them!")

Battle of Thermopylae
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whiskeymike
Average Member

USA
285 Posts

Posted - May 06 2008 :  11:33:48 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Reloader

I believe it was Elmer Keith who said, "Beware of ther man with one gun; he will know how to use it." Please correct me if I am mistaken.


Don't know if Elmer Keith did or not; I read much of what he wrote in the 60's and went back to find older stuff.
Anyway, the search engine yields this remark in the middle of a book entitled "Suggestions to Military Riflemen" by Townsend Whelen ( I believe he was a colonel).
Copyright 1909 !!

whiskeymike
Kennesaw, GA.
NRA Life Member
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wolfgang2000
Advanced Member

USA
3742 Posts

Posted - May 07 2008 :  11:13:26 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by whiskeymike

I hope this is not deemed off-topic but this is, I believe a phenomenon not limited to firearms.
Check out the ads for :
Low-mileage hot sports cars;
Low time high performance airplanes;
Low time high performance boats ( or large boats ).
I think we see it, want it, buy it and then figure out we haven't a clue what it's all about.
If we're lucky, we get rid of it before it kills us.

Not that I would ever make any decisions like that



Your right. I knew a guy that couldn't keep a camera system 30 days. Because something "new and better" was hitting the market.

Personally I'm keeping my Mowemflatmag, no matter how scarce the ammo is!

“The key is to hit them hard, hit them fast, and hit them repeatedly. The one shot stop is a unit of measurement not a tactical philosophy.” Evan Marshall
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Evan
Administrator

34116 Posts

Posted - May 07 2008 :  11:35:34 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
you can't keep up with technolgy though. I bought a Canon digital camera with 5.1 Megapixel resultion for $299.99 from a source on the internet.

When my Wife's Mom got here last month we bought her a SONY digital camera with 7.1 Megapixels smaller than a cell phone for $125 at the local Best Buy.

"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."

Harold B. Lee

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HEMI
Senior Member

Canada
881 Posts

Posted - May 07 2008 :  3:25:06 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I have a brother that has to have the latest gadget.
I buy his new old stuff for reduced price of course.
Guns have not changed much over the last hundred or so years,
you still have a trigger and it still goes bang.
Still nice to have new stuff though.

kev
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Malcolm
Advanced Member

USA
4008 Posts

Posted - May 07 2008 :  7:29:00 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I do believe Hemi and I share the same brother. Seriously.
I cannot believe the "cast-offs" my brother has blessed me with, yahoo.
His new "thing" now is piston vs standard Ar-15's. I'm waiting another of his decisions to change, of course I'll buy them from him, unless he forces me to accept the gift.
Scored a new Wilson KZ-45 from him, as he found it less than accurate as he "prefers a Kimber". OK, MY Wilson KZ-45 is very, very accurate, and my neighbor a die-hard Kimber fanatic wants to trade me SOME of his Kimbers for MY KZ-45. Nope, not going to happen.
I have tried to get some reassurance in my time with little success. On the other hand, I've seen a lot of laughter directed at/with me....does that count?

"The measure of a man's character, is how he treats someone who can do nothing for him." (unknown)
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ought6
Senior Member

USA
713 Posts

Posted - May 07 2008 :  7:56:20 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hey,

Y'all are talking too loudly. If it weren't for the guys who buy these "cool" guns and sell them later, guys like me couldn't go to the candy store and peruse the used guns for great deals on guns that weren't even broken in yet.

Psalms 18:34-35 He trains my hands for battle, So that my arms can bend a bow of bronze. (35) You have also given me the shield of Your salvation, And Your right hand upholds me; And Your gentleness makes me great.

ought6
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Evan
Administrator

34116 Posts

Posted - May 07 2008 :  8:58:49 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
yup-I need to get a .45 ACP for articles and such and I know just the place to look-the place has had "used" Glocks at very reasonable prices and most look unfired.

"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."

Harold B. Lee

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