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 Economy Winchester and Remington ammo

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T O P I C    R E V I E W
ajt Posted - March 31 2019 : 4:57:45 PM
I have been using Winchester Wildcats (whitebox) .22s for practically my whole life. They were what was available at the local general store when I was a kid and the store owner never hesitated to sell them to us at ages 10 to 12 years old (over sixty years ago when everybody knew everybody, and everybody's business, in a small town of 800). Left there in my mid twenties and all of my .22s were sighted in with this ammo and it was great for tin cans out to 100 yds with an old Savaage 4C bolt action with a Weaver 'tip off' scope. I just kept using it. Picked up more over the years and still have a small stock of it. Last Christmas a relative gave me a supply of Remington Thunderbolts and we got out the .22s and tried some at the range. They are listed as being the same velocity and weight as the Wildcats, but hit just slightly lower and left of them. We noticed that there is a lot less smoke with the Remingtons. They probably tie for mis-fires but both are only used for range ammo. I have CCI mini-mags if ever needed for any other use, but in all honesty I have experienced mis-fires with the mini's, too, but they do fire cleaner. I think that its just the nature of .22 rimfires. Recently I saw a video where the presenter really talked down the Thunderbolts. I notice that they sell well at the LGS and are priced lower than the WW. Anyone have a history with them?
5   L A T E S T    R E P L I E S    (Newest First)
ajt Posted - May 22 2019 : 08:05:11 AM
I can understand why guys who compete like Chris would be very particular about their ammo. Big investment in time, equipment, training and match fees. I'm mostly just a plinker - minute-of-pop can at 50 ft. is just fine. Some informal target shooting at the same distance when I need to get my groups down. At my age and health I can shoot a 10 shot string of .22 without a problem but need to lower the weapon and rest my arms a couple of times during a string of 9's or 45's. I have been using a red dot sight on two of my .22s and my wife and I recently took two new shooters (her female co-workers) to the range. I thought that they'd like the red dots but all three complained that it was hard to find the dot and keep it in place for each shot. They are all petite women and preferred my wife's iron sighted SR22 over anything else. Brand of ammo didn't matter to them but I explained the differences in quality, accuracy and reliability between some brands (we had one misfire in about 200 rds.). And I encouraged the new shooters to sign up at the range for lessons and to try some of their rentals before they committed to buying their first firearm.
Jim Higginbotham Posted - May 21 2019 : 08:37:52 AM
I find in general quality of ammo is suffering. I've seen more misfires or stoppages (presumably from a weak powder charge) in all ammo used in classes for the last 5 or 6 years than I did in the previous 40 years.

Even in duty ammo we see more but not nearly as much as the regular ball ammo - nearly all 9mm - used in classes.

I don't know whether it is just that they are making so much some slips or if it is the new way they make primers?

No doubt some of it is contributed to by the guns - striker fired guns are more sensitive to cartridge length. Mind you it is not the guns' fault it is still an ammo quality control issue. I see more misfires in revolvers as well though they don't show up in class very often.

I've got a batch of Winchester .45 auto ammo that is roll crimped! Naturally it sits in the chamber deeper.

I do buy whatever there is a good deal on in .22 but, like Chris, if it is serious, I am pretty picky. I'll second the CCI recommendation and also RWS subsonic or even Aguila.

Jim H.
Chris Christian Posted - April 01 2019 : 07:03:53 AM
Russ, I'm not concerned with bullet expansion. I just want adequate accuracy (under an inch at 25 yards) and total reliability.

For handguns I favor CCI Standard Velocity. It seems to be as good as any "match load" I used when I was shooting Bullseye. It also works in rifles, but some competition timers have a problem picking up the shot because there is no sonic crack.

In rifles, CCI Mini-Mag (36 jhp or 40 solid), Aguila Super Extra, and Federal Hunter Match have proven themselves. I'm also very impressed with CCI's new Clean-22. It's a polymer coated bullet (red for high speed and blue for standard velocity). I recently put about 1400 rounds, mixed, through a Ruger 10/22 without a single malfunction. I ran 800 rounds before even running a patch through the barrel. After that a solvent patch and a dry patch and the barrel looked unfired. A finally ran a bore brush after 1400 rounds, and found I really didn't need to. My Ruger MKIV doesn't like the blue, but my MKII does. The rifle loves both.

If I did want expansion on game I'd use the Federal Hunter Match LHP.
Russ Larges Posted - April 01 2019 : 05:57:28 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Chris Christian

Can't comment on direct experience with either load mentioned ... other than to note that I shoot 3 or 4 Steel Challenge matches a month. There are a half-dozen other shooters there in Grand Master and Master class in Rimfire Rifle and Rimfire Pistol. Not one of them will use Rem or Win ammo. I won't either, and I'm just a mere A Class shooter in both divisions.

A low-stress plinking session, where a misfire is a minor annoyance is one thing. Spend time & gas to drive to a match, pay money to shoot, try to win... and a malfunction of any type means you won't win (not at that level).

These guys are shooting 20,000 rounds of .22LR a year. I only run about 12,000.

But we all pass on Rem and Win. Quality control issues.




So Chris, what do you shoot when it counts.
Russ
Chris Christian Posted - March 31 2019 : 5:24:50 PM
Can't comment on direct experience with either load mentioned ... other than to note that I shoot 3 or 4 Steel Challenge matches a month. There are a half-dozen other shooters there in Grand Master and Master class in Rimfire Rifle and Rimfire Pistol. Not one of them will use Rem or Win ammo. I won't either, and I'm just a mere A Class shooter in both divisions.

A low-stress plinking session, where a misfire is a minor annoyance is one thing. Spend time & gas to drive to a match, pay money to shoot, try to win... and a malfunction of any type means you won't win (not at that level).

These guys are shooting 20,000 rounds of .22LR a year. I only run about 12,000.

But we all pass on Rem and Win. Quality control issues.

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